Electrical issue?

[RVH]

OK, been reading previous post for about 4 hrs now and dont know any more than I did before I started except where certain components are located.....06 mastiff has been fine for the 1200 miles or so that I've put on it until day before yesterday. Went out to crank it and the battery was too weak to turn it over so I threw the charger on for a few hrs and it fired right up. Made several stops that day with no further issues..... Went to fire it up yesterday and same thing. Put it on the charger for about 30 mins and she fired right up. Rode to a local bike show for a few hrs and when I left, she fired right up. Rode down to the lake and stopped for about 15 mins and when I hit the starter she acted as though the battery was weak again. Finally got it fired up & made it home, cut it off and tried to crank it again immediately. As I hit the starter the battery acted weak again and I had smoke coming from either the starter area or the little module mounted under the battery box. Had other plans so I removed the battery and put it on charge overnite. Had a full charge this morning so I installed it, cut the switch on. After I hit the run button the EHC has a red light only lit. The ignition module has a red light lit. The little module under the battery has a red led that blinks continuously about every 5 secs. (alarm maybe?) I hit the start buttom for only 2 secs and same thing. Motor barely turns over and more smoke comes from the starter area. Still cant tell if its from the starter or the mass of wiring in front of the battery box. ....Could it be that the compression releases are not working and the starter is laboring? (only hit the start button for a second or 2) Sorry for the long post but wanted anyone who tries to help me to have the whole picture. Any advice will be appreciated.

Robert

 

[hoat]

You can push the compression releases in by hand before you try and start it with a weak battery. just push down on the plastic boot and you will feel it move

Sounds like you have a weak battery and need to replace it I am sure that someone will make a better battery recommendation than me.

 

[RVH]

Thanks hoat. Man, I hope it is that simple. Already pulled the battery and will take it to Autozone after Mothers Day dinner(thats lunch to u northern folks,lol) and let them test it under load. Checked it after charging and it had a full 12.6V. Would a weak battery alone cause the smoke? Also if the battery test good, Ill manually set the releases and see what happens........to be continued

 

[Raywood]

Sounds pretty evident from your first post that the battery is shot. When you replace it buy a "Battery Tender" and keep you bike on it daily, it's called "Life Support"!!

 

[Gas Man]

The bike needs 12.8 all the time. It sounds like the battery is bad but maybe a bad starter as well. No way it should be smoking.

 

[RVH]

OK, had it tested at Autozone and Advance. Battery checks out good under load. Had the same initial voltage as I got with my voltmeter(12.6) ... Ray, I have a battery tender but I dont use it if I ride everyday, which I have been. Bike has always crank almost before I can get my thumb off the button .... Gas, I'm with you the smok'n thing. Weak battery alone shouldn't cause it. Probably is coming from the starter but is that the problem? Wondering why for the 2 times it wouldn't crank at home, I could just put a little charge on the battery and it fire right up? Could the starter have been going bad and draining my battery somehow and has now finally went capoot? How do I check the starter? I know how to jump a car starter but I dont wanna be spark'n up the chrome on this one.......Thanks for the input & advice and I know from following this board for awhile, I'll get it worked out with a little help from you guys.

 

[Raywood]

OK, had it tested at Autozone and Advance. Battery checks out good under load. Had the same initial voltage as I got with my voltmeter(12.6) ... Ray, I have a battery tender but I dont use it if I ride everyday, which I have been. Bike has always crank almost before I can get my thumb off the button .... Gas, I'm with you the smok'n thing. Weak battery alone shouldn't cause it. Probably is coming from the starter but is that the problem? Wondering why for the 2 times it wouldn't crank at home, I could just put a little charge on the battery and it fire right up? Could the starter have been going bad and draining my battery somehow and has now finally went capoot? How do I check the starter? I know how to jump a car starter but I dont wanna be spark'n up the chrome on this one.......Thanks for the input & advice and I know from following this board for awhile, I'll get it worked out with a little help from you guys.

Well, your 12.6 isn't enough voltage so still sounds like a battery problem.

I've had the smoking starter before and it was back when we had the problem with leaking primaries satruating the starter. Oil would get in the battery cable and would smoke when you hit the starter. Just something to check out.

:flag:

 

[RVH]

Thanks Ray. When I rub my fingers around the wires that enter the starter on the right side, they smell burnt. Is this where the oil saturated the wires? The smoke comes so quick after hitting the start button that its hard to believe that oil would heat up enough to smoke. I have a gut feeling its the starter. Any way to check it with a meter before I go to the trouble of pulling it?

 

[RVH]

Tried the battery one more time and it still wont crank but no smoke this time. Just doesn't have quite enough juice to turn it fast. Re-thinking the "starter gut feeling" thing". Think I'll look for a Yuasa YTXZO20HL tomorrow. This is the original battery(almost 3 yrs) so its about due to be replaced anyway. Thanks for all the input and I'll keep you updated.

 

[superfly]

RVH,
These dogs are notorius for eating batteries.. I had similar problem. Always go with battery first. Least expensive. someone on here once said that one start of the dog will take 20 min of riding at 2k rpm to recharge. If you do a bunch of short trips around town etc and the battery is suspect you will have these problems.. good luck let us know how it turns out..

 

[Gas Man]

super... actually I believe it was 20 miles of riding to recharge one start. Bar hoppin = do the math.

Get a new battery. I think the interstates have been suggested for higher CCA. However, I have been running a HD softail AGM battery in mine... works great $90.

Oh and AGM is important on your charging system.

 

[Fibersnake]

RVH,

With a AGM type battery using 6 cells, 12.6 is too low for full charge. Even the older Lead Calcium type normally have a 2.13 VPC (Volt per cell) with a sp of 1200 or 12.78 minimum. The AGM typically have 2.25 VPC minimum or about 13.5 VDC for 6 cell and may go up to mid 14 VDC depending on how it has been charged and floated.

Bottom line if after a good charge with a AGM type, if it is not showing mid 13VDC, it is not fully charged or taking charge and maybe time to look at replacement.

Anything over 2 years on a AGM is time to have money sit aside for possible replacement. Life will depend on many variables such as charge discharge cycles, float levels, temps, etc.

 

[Gas Man]

I agree Fiber... every 2 years with these bikes. That is a big motor and the starter pulls some major power.

 

[RVH]

Thanks guys..... Should any AGM type with at least 300 CCA work? (as long as it will fit) I'm kind've in a pinch as I'm bust'n my butt to finish a job today so I can head to Myrtle in the morning. Not much time to run around and find a battery and the only dealer I have nearby is a Yamaha guy. Might have to take what I can get for now......My Indian was hauled down by friend last week or I could try the battery out of it just to make sure thats the problem.

 

[ChuckRB05]

re

I replaced my battery with Drag Specialties...310 cranking amps. Drag Specialties :: Electrical > Batteries > DRAG SPECIALTIES BATTERIES
One of the techs in service recomended it and I haven't had any trouble since.

 

[Fibersnake]

RVH,

Yes a 300CCA rated AGM that will fit in the spot should work. If you get one, make sure that you put it on charge with the battery tender if you have one, if not a low amp (say 2amp) on a regular charger for a while. Also if the work time and weather allows, would recommend that you take it for a nice ride of say an hour or so later today to make sure everything is good.

If you are still having issues or not sure if everything is good to go, find the BDM truck and have the tech take a look at it to make sure it is all good.

Have fun and hopefully the weather is good for you all. I know that yesterday was a bad day down south with Tornados and other heavy stuff going on.

 

[superfly]

super... actually I believe it was 20 miles of riding to recharge one start. Bar hoppin = do the math.

Get a new battery. I think the interstates have been suggested for higher CCA. However, I have been running a HD softail AGM battery in mine... works great $90.

Oh and AGM is important on your charging system.

Gas thanks for the clarification :2thumbs:

 

[RVH]

Thanks again guys. Im still on my job right now but got a friend who owns a crotch rocket shop to order a battery from Drag Specialties(even before I seen ChuckRB05's post). 310 CCA, same size and AGM. He said it was made by Yuasa for big " motors so should be fine. $99 and I pick it up in the morning.....Thanks Fiber, will definately charge on the 2 amp trickle and take her for a spin. Looks like maybe wed now before I get to leave.(knocking on wood)...... Who else is going to Myrtle?

 

[Throttle Jockey]

One other thing to consider is the contacts in the solenoid. If the contacts are very dirty like some have shown here you could be getting low voltage into the starter causing it to smoke. It sounds like you ride it a lot and start it many times. The contacts could be very pitted, dirty, and burnt.

Throttle Jockey

 

[RVH]

Thanks T.J. Yeah, guess my screename should've been barhopper.lol. Looks like I'm gonna have a little time this afternoon. I have to pull the starter to remove the soleniod, right? I'm not home so I cant remember how it sits on the starter. Rather take a little time today than be sitting roadside at the beach later.