Bandit Clutch

[lee]

Well I went ahead and ordered the bandit clutch and it arrived at Lisa's hotel in New York today so I removed the stock set up tonight. If anyone is doing this the socket sizes you need are 33mm for the motor drive nut (as Jake eventually found out and is covered in his thread) and 30mm for the clutch hub nut.

As a tip, I wedged a spanner in between the two sets of sprockets when undoing the nuts. I have to say the nuts came off easier than I was expecting - especially the engine drive nut (or whatever it is called) which came off easier than the clutch hub nut. Came off no problem at all with just a breaker bar. I didn't see any signs of red loctite on either thread!

My carrier was not broken but there were scratches on the inside primary cover like someone else found on theirs - can't remember who, may have been BB.

When I pulled the clutch off the fluid leaked through the seal a lot - when I slipped the clutch back on though it was ok - is this tranmission fluid?

Tomorrow I'm off to Andy's to get the BDM hub pressed out of the old and into the new, then hopefully all back together and running. Hopefully the hub won't get damaged as happened with Jake because apparently they are not available from BDM right now.

I have to say the service from Bandit was top notch - Lisa is going back out to the same hotel next week and I was hoping to get it there for that but it arrived today! very quick!

 

[barhopper]

Thats what I like about Lee, he's always tinkering with the Dog. Seems like your never are satisfied with standing still. :2thumbs:

 

[Bulldog03]

If anyone is doing this the socket sizes you need are 33mm for the motor drive nut (as Jake eventually found out and is covered in his thread) and 30mm for the clutch hub nut.

What way is it to loosen each? left for the motor drive nut and was it right for the clutch hub nut? I'm going to install a Karata belt drive soon and looking for all the info I can before I even start....

 

[lee]

What way is it to loosen each? left for the motor drive nut and was it right for the clutch hub nut? I'm going to install a Karata belt drive soon and looking for all the info I can before I even start....

you got it - clutch hub nut is reverse thread

 

[Gas Man]

The input shaft on these tranny's always leak when you remove the clutch hub. Mine did and so did Jake's.

 

[bdmridgeback]

The scratches on the inner primary happen to all of the bikes with a broken carrier. Yours must have broke at one time or another. Look at it close because it can be cracked all the way around but will not pull apart into two pieces. This what yours looked like:

 

[lee]

Thats what I like about Lee, he's always tinkering with the Dog. Seems like your never are satisfied with standing still. :2thumbs:

thanks barhopper - I just thought with the woods cam, zero deck, PSI on the way my stock 2005 clutch may not hold up too well and especially seeing some of the horror stories on here - also, all the performance mods in the world are a waste of time and money if the power aint getting to the back wheel

I also gotta give a shout out to Jake here who answered some questions I had before ordering - Thanks Jake :2thumbs:

 

[lee]

The scratches on the inner primary happen to all of the bikes with a broken carrier. Yours must have broke at one time or another. Look at it close because it can be cracked all the way around but will not pull apart into two pieces. This what yours looked like:

thats exactly what it looked like - I had a fairly good look at it and it seemed ok - better safe than sorry though

 

[Bulldog03]

you got it - clutch hub nut is reverse thread

Thanks braddah!!:2thumbs: I knew I read it in one of the other belt drive threads, just needed to be extra sure...

 

[lee]

The input shaft on these tranny's always leak when you remove the clutch hub. Mine did and so did Jake's.

yeah thanks Chris - I remembered that but didn't know where it was - thanks for putting my mind at rest :2thumbs:

 

[Gas Man]

And you can see the same thing in Jake's pics

 

[bdmridgeback]

Lee, did you buy your bike used?

If you did, it probably broke before you got it and was replaced.

 

[lee]

Lee, did you buy your bike used?

If you did, it probably broke before you got it and was replaced.

yeah it had 2,300 miles on it when I bought it - I might even have the updated carrier but now that I'm changing it anyway I can't be arsed to check right now - updated carrier or not, I'm still glad I'm going with the bandit for the improved grab etc

 

[Fibersnake]

On the scratch inner primary. The marks do tend to be a good sign that the carrier had been replaced, however when discussing with my dealer recently, they inidicated that is not always the case and that some have done this due to very close clearance between clutch and inner primary. They went on further to say that there is shim that now goes between the clutch and input to lessen the chance for this to occur.

Not sure of all the details for it was a quick general conversation, hopefully one of the folks near puppy farm or a knowledgeable dealer on here can clarify.

If I find out more details will post.

 

[slowrower]

On the scratch inner primary. The marks do tend to be a good sign that the carrier had been replaced, however when discussing with my dealer recently, they inidicated that is not always the case and that some have done this due to very close clearance between clutch and inner primary. They went on further to say that there is shim that now goes between the clutch and input to lessen the chance for this to occur.

Not sure of all the details for it was a quick general conversation, hopefully one of the folks near puppy farm or a knowledgeable dealer on here can clarify.

If I find out more details will post.

This is what I found recently when replacing a clutch pak, I pulled the basket off and found light scratches on the inner-primary. The basket was fine so I think your right on regarding a slight clearance problem that may or may not show up. I am calling BDM to see about getting a shim to prevent this from happening again.

 

[lee]

if thats true sounds like a bad design to me - scratches means no clearance if you ask me. Presumably the shim is only a few thou thick and you would also need one for the drive sprocket too to keep the alignment in check

 

[Firestream]

Lee,

There is an update for 2005 models that uses a shim behind the clutch hub to correct alignment issues. The dealer performed this on my 2005 chopper as well as several other updates in an attempt to correct clutch slippage. So far none of the fixes cured the slipping. I also purchased the Bandit package including the carrier hub and just picked up a new BDM flanged hub that I ordered a couple of week ago. You might want to call again on that part as my dealer didn't indicate there was any problem with back orders. As far as the shim goes, I called Bandit and asked about whether to leave shim in place with new assembly and they indicated to try it with shim first and then check alignment with straight edge. If good then leave it in place. They also stated the locking tabs on the inner primary bolts may present a clearance problem with the Bandit carrier hub if they stick up higher then the bolt face. The tabs may be ground even with the face to prevent an issue. Since the shim update was used to correct an existing alignment problem, there may not be a need for a shim on the engine sproket if the alignment is corrected with the clutch shim. Once I get everything together I will let you know what I discover with the shim in place.

 

[slowrower]

Lee,

There is an update for 2005 models that uses a shim behind the clutch hub to correct alignment issues. The dealer performed this on my 2005 chopper as well as several other updates in an attempt to correct clutch slippage. So far none of the fixes cured the slipping. I also purchased the Bandit package including the carrier hub and just picked up a new BDM flanged hub that I ordered a couple of week ago. You might want to call again on that part as my dealer didn't indicate there was any problem with back orders. As far as the shim goes, I called Bandit and asked about whether to leave shim in place with new assembly and they indicated to try it with shim first and then check alignment with straight edge. If good then leave it in place. They also stated the locking tabs on the inner primary bolts may present a clearance problem with the Bandit carrier hub if they stick up higher then the bolt face. The tabs may be ground even with the face to prevent an issue. Since the shim update was used to correct an existing alignment problem, there may not be a need for a shim on the engine sproket if the alignment is corrected with the clutch shim. Once I get everything together I will let you know what I discover with the shim in place.

If your clutch is slipping what fluid are you using in your primary? reason I ask is I had to replace one that had synthetic in the primary case which caused it to slip so bad it wore out the clutch discs. I use Redline Primary Fluid which is very similar to ATF in viscosity, color and even smellls like it. Stuff works great and new clutch grabs like hell!

 

[Fibersnake]

Lee it could be design or possibly the cast inner primary was high in some spots. Not sure but from what little I got, the shim is not very thick and does not effect the alignment tolerance. Also I have not pulled my clutch yet, but if I was and found th scratches on it, I would more than likely leave it alone as far as shim goes, since I figure that it would have rubbed as much as it going to rub off per say.

Would like to see some more detail info from some of the dealers or other folks with first hand knowledge though. It sure would help clarify some things!!!

 

[lee]

Thanks gents - I'm with you Fiber on the scratches thing - my hub was spinning freely when I got the primary off so I guess any contact with the inner primary has already been done with.

well I got the Bandit installed today. I took it to Andy to press the hub out of the old carrier and into the new - anyone doing this make sure the carrier is well supported all round as Andy noticed it was flexing quite badly. He also put the thing together with green loctite.

When I got it all together it didn't work at all - I tried forcing the clutch lever (yeah I know but I do things like that) and have maybe fucked the cable - we'll see. I tore it back down and decided to look at the instructions...yeah I know.

There is a timing mark both on the carrier and the pressure plate - you will need a magnifying glass strapped to a pair of binoculars to see these marks - you have to follow the instructions and get these marks lined up correctly. I put everything back together and it worked great. I then took the springs back out and put 2 shims in each to provide 300 ibs of force. The lever is quite stiff now but I seriously doubt the clutch will slip!

I went for a quick test ride and everything seems good - for the first time since I've had the bike I don't have a very heavy clunk on the initial change into first gear from a cold start.

Happy days.