06 K9 Wires Plus Issue

[jsburkey21]

so i have an update; Completely re-wired the bike and the same issue.... dug into it deeper and found the handlebar switches were not working. Ordered a set of handlebar switches and now everything works as it should, however, now this POS wont start! I called Wild Steel Works and he walked us through a couple possible issues and wound up selling me a crank sensor. Got the new sensor Next Day Aired. Plugged it in, still nothing... We tested both the old and new crank sensor by using a multimeter set to AC voltage. Turned the bike over, Nothing on either. We plugged the sensor back into the wiring harness and tried it again but this time back probing the connector. NOTHING. Thinking we just might not be seeing the AC voltage on the Multimeter we used an Oscilloscope, NOTHING. Called back to Wild Steel Works and got an odd reply from him. He said that the crank sensor he sold us was tested before it left and that the "magnet probably fell off the crank". Im not the best with electrical but the magnet is in the sensor and the crank should have reliefs in it that collapse the magnetic field and create AC voltage. I have never heard of, or seen a crank trigger system that used a magnet on the crank. Can anyone confirm or deny this? Does anyone have an actual procedure for testing a crank sensor on one of these bikes? AM I SERIOUSLY UNLUCKY ENOUGH TO HAVE A BAD CRANK SENSOR AND A BAD REPLACEMENT? KEEP IN MIND THE BIKE WAS RUNNING, I TURNED THE KEY OFF TO RE-WIRE IT THINKING THE EHC WAS BAD AND IT WAS THE HANDLEBAR BUTTONS THE ENTIRE TIME.....

 

[Jersey Big Mike]

so i have an update; Completely re-wired the bike and the same issue.... dug into it deeper and found the handlebar switches were not working. Ordered a set of handlebar switches and now everything works as it should, however, now this POS wont start! I called Wild Steel Works and he walked us through a couple possible issues and wound up selling me a crank sensor. Got the new sensor Next Day Aired. Plugged it in, still nothing... We tested both the old and new crank sensor by using a multimeter set to AC voltage. Turned the bike over, Nothing on either. We plugged the sensor back into the wiring harness and tried it again but this time back probing the connector. NOTHING. Thinking we just might not be seeing the AC voltage on the Multimeter we used an Oscilloscope, NOTHING. Called back to Wild Steel Works and got an odd reply from him. He said that the crank sensor he sold us was tested before it left and that the "magnet probably fell off the crank". Im not the best with electrical but the magnet is in the sensor and the crank should have reliefs in it that collapse the magnetic field and create AC voltage. I have never heard of, or seen a crank trigger system that used a magnet on the crank. Can anyone confirm or deny this? Does anyone have an actual procedure for testing a crank sensor on one of these bikes? AM I SERIOUSLY UNLUCKY ENOUGH TO HAVE A BAD CRANK SENSOR AND A BAD REPLACEMENT? KEEP IN MIND THE BIKE WAS RUNNING, I TURNED THE KEY OFF TO RE-WIRE IT THINKING THE EHC WAS BAD AND IT WAS THE HANDLEBAR BUTTONS THE ENTIRE TIME.....

On that type of sensor you would measure the resistance across the two wires (assuming it is same as 08)
My spare sensor reads around 1K it looks like (meter is a little flaky and I don't feel like looking for the others)

A 2 wire sensor will be a coil that will produce an AC voltage.
A 3 wire sensor would be a hall effect device that produces a square wave and typically a "missing pulse or two"

Since you just re-wired this, can I suggest a more likely cause.
Check that the run/off switch is working. Since everything was re-done including switches I find this would be far more likely than the crank sensor suddenly going out. (and getting a bad one from Curtis as well.)

While Curtis appears to have mis-spoke regarding magnet/crank sensor, I'm sure it wasn't intentional to mis-lead you.

Check the run/off wiring. (I'm assuming you remember to press it. -- I've seen people forget)

 

[jsburkey21]

the run/off switch is testing fine (as far as i can tell). I have power to the coil and when i trip the front or rear coil trigger wire from + to a ground the coil fires. The EHC turns on and all the lights are working properly. The red light on the ignition module also turns on pointing toward it getting voltage. All of the other items associated with the run/off switch are working fine.

I agree; a 2-wire sensor will produce AC voltage when a ferrous item passes in front of it. I.E. wave a piece of metal in front of it and i should see AC voltage being produced. The new sensor from Curtis does not do this. Neither does the old one. I plan to take a video today on how we are testing the sensors, but it is very straight forward. One terminal on the sensor to one wire of the multimeter, the other terminal attached to the remaining wire on the multimeter. Its AC voltage so polarity doesnt matter. Turn multimeter to AC, wave piece of metal in front of it. We are getting nothing testing like that, with it installed in the bike, or using an Oscilloscope. We can vaguely see an AC voltage of around .01v on the Oscilloscope but my understanding is that it should be around 1.5v or higher. Correct? All arrows point toward a bad sensor but i just have a hard time believing that 2 sensors went bad back to back... Anything else to check before i condemn this crank sensor?

 

[jsburkey21]

 

[Jersey Big Mike]

the run/off switch is testing fine (as far as i can tell). I have power to the coil and when i trip the front or rear coil trigger wire from + to a ground the coil fires. The EHC turns on and all the lights are working properly. The red light on the ignition module also turns on pointing toward it getting voltage. All of the other items associated with the run/off switch are working fine.

I agree; a 2-wire sensor will produce AC voltage when a ferrous item passes in front of it. I.E. wave a piece of metal in front of it and i should see AC voltage being produced. The new sensor from Curtis does not do this. Neither does the old one. I plan to take a video today on how we are testing the sensors, but it is very straight forward. One terminal on the sensor to one wire of the multimeter, the other terminal attached to the remaining wire on the multimeter. Its AC voltage so polarity doesnt matter. Turn multimeter to AC, wave piece of metal in front of it. We are getting nothing testing like that, with it installed in the bike, or using an Oscilloscope. We can vaguely see an AC voltage of around .01v on the Oscilloscope but my understanding is that it should be around 1.5v or higher. Correct? All arrows point toward a bad sensor but i just have a hard time believing that 2 sensors went bad back to back... Anything else to check before i condemn this crank sensor?

even though you are looking for an AC voltage, put you DVM on DC on like a 2V scale.
I have one meter that see's it on the DC, the other see it on the AC side (off bike with my moving steel by hand, which might be a frequency issue)
Later tonight maybe I'll try my cheap little DSO and see what it gets.

Can you feel the magnet in the sensor pull on your test target? Mine's got decent pull.

 

[Mikeinjersey]

the run/off switch is testing fine (as far as i can tell). I have power to the coil and when i trip the front or rear coil trigger wire from + to a ground the coil fires. The EHC turns on and all the lights are working properly. The red light on the ignition module also turns on pointing toward it getting voltage. All of the other items associated with the run/off switch are working fine.

I agree; a 2-wire sensor will produce AC voltage when a ferrous item passes in front of it. I.E. wave a piece of metal in front of it and i should see AC voltage being produced. The new sensor from Curtis does not do this. Neither does the old one. I plan to take a video today on how we are testing the sensors, but it is very straight forward. One terminal on the sensor to one wire of the multimeter, the other terminal attached to the remaining wire on the multimeter. Its AC voltage so polarity doesnt matter. Turn multimeter to AC, wave piece of metal in front of it. We are getting nothing testing like that, with it installed in the bike, or using an Oscilloscope. We can vaguely see an AC voltage of around .01v on the Oscilloscope but my understanding is that it should be around 1.5v or higher. Correct? All arrows point toward a bad sensor but i just have a hard time believing that 2 sensors went bad back to back... Anything else to check before i condemn this crank sensor?

Check out this Diagflowchart it may help you decide what to do. Start with section ( Engine Cranks but won't start). Don't discount anything as a possible problem. You could backtrack and doublecheck everything you did while installing the new wiring.

 

[jsburkey21]

WELL WE FIGURED IT OUT. So the wires from the crank sensor to the ignition module got cut and the was continuity between the wires. We pulled the heat shrink and wire loom off and sure enough, there were 2 wires touching. separated them, and BAM, got signal. Hooked the wires up to the bike and it fired right off!

Let this be a lesson. If you dont get AC voltage when testing the crank position sensor check for cross-continuity in the harness from the crank sensor to the ignition module. If the wires are touching the multimeter will not show AC voltage...

 

[Rottweiler]

Glad to hear you got to the real problem. Sometimes it's the last place you would think.