Clutch wont engage
- Thread starter Krgriff74
- Start date
I'd take the derby cover off, pull the clutch lever and watch the pressure plate move out at the clutch basket.
a. It moves out in a linear way so the throw follows a large gap at the friction plate to plate.
b. Where the lever moves and does not stop at the grip, the pressure plate hardly moved out, but did a little.
You make no mention about the lever not reaching the grip, so you'd assume full throw at the lever, full throw at the pushrod.
I would now kick it up to 2nd or down to 1st, just have the back wheel about to roll back and forth to break free the clutch.
a. Meaning, lever to the grip and now roll the wheel back and forth till you break the clutch pack loose.
b. If it does not break lose, next is to adjust the pushrod throw.
c. No joy at the adjustment, remove clutch pack and inspect.
d. Second derby inspection move is the whole clutch basket. This should show the whole basket move as in, taking place of the pressure plate moving. That wheel walk back and forth might point it out of no, or very little pressure plate movement taking up the throw w/basket. So a loose center nut at the transmission's main shaft is a variable.
See if you followed standard procedure.
1. I pulled the clutch throw housing off the side of the trans.
2. I pulled the ramp assembly, unhooked, rehooked the cable clutch end, homed the ramp to the deepest ball cutout, installed cover back on.
3. I pulled the cable center adjust boot so I could spin the threads to make the outer cable shorter.
4. I pulled the the derby cover off and spun the center rod adjust bolt in till it lightly seated and ran it back out 1/8 turn.
5. I pulled the lever pin [if applies] set the other end of the cable end to the lever and reinstalled.
6. I ran the threads back out to extend the outer cable till I had zero play at the perch to lever gap, locked the set nut as did the rod's set nut.
7. I still had the bike in gear and when I pushed the back wheel, the clutch freed up, could keep my lever to the grip and hand spun the pressure plate a full few spins to see no drag on the 360° spins.
8. I installed the derby cover, took it for a ride and found N without an ankle sprain.
Signed,
Only assembles one way, only adjusts one way
a. It moves out in a linear way so the throw follows a large gap at the friction plate to plate.
b. Where the lever moves and does not stop at the grip, the pressure plate hardly moved out, but did a little.
You make no mention about the lever not reaching the grip, so you'd assume full throw at the lever, full throw at the pushrod.
I would now kick it up to 2nd or down to 1st, just have the back wheel about to roll back and forth to break free the clutch.
a. Meaning, lever to the grip and now roll the wheel back and forth till you break the clutch pack loose.
b. If it does not break lose, next is to adjust the pushrod throw.
c. No joy at the adjustment, remove clutch pack and inspect.
d. Second derby inspection move is the whole clutch basket. This should show the whole basket move as in, taking place of the pressure plate moving. That wheel walk back and forth might point it out of no, or very little pressure plate movement taking up the throw w/basket. So a loose center nut at the transmission's main shaft is a variable.
See if you followed standard procedure.
1. I pulled the clutch throw housing off the side of the trans.
2. I pulled the ramp assembly, unhooked, rehooked the cable clutch end, homed the ramp to the deepest ball cutout, installed cover back on.
3. I pulled the cable center adjust boot so I could spin the threads to make the outer cable shorter.
4. I pulled the the derby cover off and spun the center rod adjust bolt in till it lightly seated and ran it back out 1/8 turn.
5. I pulled the lever pin [if applies] set the other end of the cable end to the lever and reinstalled.
6. I ran the threads back out to extend the outer cable till I had zero play at the perch to lever gap, locked the set nut as did the rod's set nut.
7. I still had the bike in gear and when I pushed the back wheel, the clutch freed up, could keep my lever to the grip and hand spun the pressure plate a full few spins to see no drag on the 360° spins.
8. I installed the derby cover, took it for a ride and found N without an ankle sprain.
Signed,
Only assembles one way, only adjusts one way
Mr. Wright
Knows some things
When you adjust the clutch, make sure the cable is slack, then run your rod until it just touches the throwout bearing. Then you're going to back it off 1/8 of a turn and tighten the nut. Then adjust your cable to take the slack out of the handle. If you have the rod too tight against the throwout bearing it won't allow the disc to engage.
Exactly. first thing I thought was the ball ramp to be sent home... it caught me out too was the schooling of this style.
See #2.
Mr. Squid, how are you about to load the rod when you have yet to buckle the outer cable with tension. That cable is so slacked, go put your hand on the cable spreader and feel it go erect like the old days. Get it? Tell me you loaded the outer cable like a bow string and back it off from there. The windup is first take that slack out of the cable ends at the spreader is the perch adjust? It's that kind of feel for those in the know... aka, one who has the touch for it.
Signed,
It sure ain't you
I gotta tell ya I wish someone would make a video & share it here of this process of adjustment. I read these explanations and it might as well be written in Chinese. I just don’t understand the stuff I gotta tell ya. Not super mechanically inclined, but if I see it once I can figure it out. Sounds like it takes place quite often hopefully someone can set a camera up. I been waiting for Marky-Mark to do one.
Mr. Wright
Knows some things
I definitely don't understand what he just said.
1 B.M.F.
Well-Known Member
You are MR SQUID. Apparently he is upset with you because you put an angry face on his rant. Lol.
Far from being upset. It's the virus going on around me. Another site someone put up a vid and I pointed out only squids do that kind of shit in so many words. Not his line of work but he's boasting over a million hits on utube. So I assed him if he sand blasted the finish off the inside of that caliper he was rebuilding? He shows it is now powdercoated and you can tell it blasted off the finish. I threw up another vid of his, and asked him how many times is he going to wear out the bleeder's tapered hole on the caliper nipple open an closing? I have a vid of mine I thru up there and I only close it once and have a pedal.
They don't like me there either because I keep seeing those squid moves and call them out on it. They just deleted my posts on the call outs on Mr. Millhits a few days ago. They forget I entertain myself instigating the regulars on the forums. So no, nothing against Mr. Squid, just part of the sport. If he's confused about clutch setup being it only adjusts one way... It ain't my bike. Go right ahead and call it your way.
partsfinder.onlinemicrofiche.com
So anyway, Mike, while you're waiting for a vid you'll have to explain it to squidly :
43 - has a groove for a titty staking on the other side of the cover.
28 - shows that line to the part that has that titty nipple sticking out at the bottom and that remains stationary in the groove.
14 - 3 balls are used as a rolling ramp. Both 27 and 28 have that mirror finish on the teardrops for it to 'throwout.'
27 - so now that's as close as 28 and 27 can touch with the balls sunk to their deepest. Now set the rod.
Cable hooks to that C curve and 35 being a swivel so no cable kink on the ramp out and back in.
Only way to phase it out is to send the 27 one ball hole out of phase on assembly, the other two follow back to their deepest pockets still... there is the one ball to cable hook out of phase... only assembles one way. The OP phased it out. He should concur that was it.
________________________________________________
partsfinder.onlinemicrofiche.com
4 - is going to slot into 27. Both 8's are machine washers and thrust onto 7 being a needle bearing. The slinger wheel is feeding oil to the needle bearing assembly so that does not burn out. Low on oil level and the slinger emerged from it is another story.
5 - is the pushrod and inserts into 6, then 6 into 15, then 19 holds 15 into 20-left pressure plate.
6 - is turned 1/8 turn out when 27 and 28 are in their deepest setting of the two parts almost touching each other.
5 - can slide back and forth without a load. No plate is hung up or dragging as if the lever pulled in and a sloppy gap at the perch? No. Still has for sure a sloppy pushrod needing the gap taken up we start chasing N.
But the theory goes... if you can take the slack out of the perch gap, did you move the 1/8th rod sliding back and forth? Sure you did. Does the rod spin with lever pulled in or remain stationary, lever out? If the needle bearing is loaded with someone holding the clutch lever it, will it burn out or will the slinger lube it?
If you placed a .0015" feeler gauge between thrust washer 8, would there be room to lube the needle bearing? If .0015" is that cam to rocker arm gap for oil to be lubed when off each other, that's a hot engine part. With that kind of clearance, I don't see cams burning up with an oil gap that tight.
Watch the cable:
Perch - lever is pulled and you have to take that gap up. How far are we from the grip with that one move?
Pushrod - lever moves closer to the grip taking up 1/8 turn out. No more float at the rod.
Cable inner - how worn out is the pivot hole at the lever and now take that out, the lever goes farther to the grip.
Outer cables - That's 4 relax points before they square up and load... is more lever toward the grip before the pressure off the plates begin.
Signed,
N has never been easier to find.
They don't like me there either because I keep seeing those squid moves and call them out on it. They just deleted my posts on the call outs on Mr. Millhits a few days ago. They forget I entertain myself instigating the regulars on the forums. So no, nothing against Mr. Squid, just part of the sport. If he's confused about clutch setup being it only adjusts one way... It ain't my bike. Go right ahead and call it your way.
Ronnie's Harley-Davidson's 2004 Harley Davidson FXST SOFTAIL® STD (BH) | TRANSMISSION HOUSING ASSEMBLY Parts List
So anyway, Mike, while you're waiting for a vid you'll have to explain it to squidly :
43 - has a groove for a titty staking on the other side of the cover.
28 - shows that line to the part that has that titty nipple sticking out at the bottom and that remains stationary in the groove.
14 - 3 balls are used as a rolling ramp. Both 27 and 28 have that mirror finish on the teardrops for it to 'throwout.'
27 - so now that's as close as 28 and 27 can touch with the balls sunk to their deepest. Now set the rod.
Cable hooks to that C curve and 35 being a swivel so no cable kink on the ramp out and back in.
Only way to phase it out is to send the 27 one ball hole out of phase on assembly, the other two follow back to their deepest pockets still... there is the one ball to cable hook out of phase... only assembles one way. The OP phased it out. He should concur that was it.
________________________________________________
Ronnie''s Harley-Davidson''s
Ronnie's Harley-Davidson® offers service and parts, and proudly serves the areas of New Ashford, Windsor, Lenox and New Lebanon.
4 - is going to slot into 27. Both 8's are machine washers and thrust onto 7 being a needle bearing. The slinger wheel is feeding oil to the needle bearing assembly so that does not burn out. Low on oil level and the slinger emerged from it is another story.
5 - is the pushrod and inserts into 6, then 6 into 15, then 19 holds 15 into 20-left pressure plate.
6 - is turned 1/8 turn out when 27 and 28 are in their deepest setting of the two parts almost touching each other.
5 - can slide back and forth without a load. No plate is hung up or dragging as if the lever pulled in and a sloppy gap at the perch? No. Still has for sure a sloppy pushrod needing the gap taken up we start chasing N.
But the theory goes... if you can take the slack out of the perch gap, did you move the 1/8th rod sliding back and forth? Sure you did. Does the rod spin with lever pulled in or remain stationary, lever out? If the needle bearing is loaded with someone holding the clutch lever it, will it burn out or will the slinger lube it?
If you placed a .0015" feeler gauge between thrust washer 8, would there be room to lube the needle bearing? If .0015" is that cam to rocker arm gap for oil to be lubed when off each other, that's a hot engine part. With that kind of clearance, I don't see cams burning up with an oil gap that tight.
Watch the cable:
Perch - lever is pulled and you have to take that gap up. How far are we from the grip with that one move?
Pushrod - lever moves closer to the grip taking up 1/8 turn out. No more float at the rod.
Cable inner - how worn out is the pivot hole at the lever and now take that out, the lever goes farther to the grip.
Outer cables - That's 4 relax points before they square up and load... is more lever toward the grip before the pressure off the plates begin.
Signed,
N has never been easier to find.
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Mr. Wright
Knows some things
I'm not going to get in an argument with you, all I'm saying is, people come here to find help for their situation, and you are not helping. You may be good on what ever bikes you deal with, but not here.Far from being upset. It's the virus going on around me. Another site someone put up a vid and I pointed out only squids do that kind of shit in so many words. Not his line of work but he's boasting over a million hits on utube. So I assed him if he sand blasted the finish off the inside of that caliper he was rebuilding? He shows it is now powdercoated and you can tell it blasted off the finish. I threw up another vid of his, and asked him how many times is he going to wear out the bleeder's tapered hole on the caliper nipple open an closing? I have a vid of mine I thru up there and I only close it once and have a pedal.
They don't like me there either because I keep seeing those squid moves and call them out on it. They just deleted my posts on the call outs on Mr. Millhits a few days ago. They forget I entertain myself instigating the regulars on the forums. So no, nothing against Mr. Squid, just part of the sport. If he's confused about clutch setup being it only adjusts one way... It ain't my bike. Go right ahead and call it your way.
Ronnie's Harley-Davidson's 2004 Harley Davidson FXST SOFTAIL® STD (BH) | TRANSMISSION HOUSING ASSEMBLY Parts List
So anyway, Mike, while you're waiting for a vid you'll have to explain it to squidly :
43 - has a groove for a titty staking on the other side of the cover.
28 - shows that line to the part that has that titty nipple sticking out at the bottom and that remains stationary in the groove.
14 - 3 balls are used as a rolling ramp. Both 27 and 28 have that mirror finish on the teardrops for it to 'throwout.'
27 - so now that's as close as 28 and 27 can touch with the balls sunk to their deepest. Now set the rod.
Cable hooks to that C curve and 35 being a swivel so no cable kink on the ramp out and back in.
Only way to phase it out is to send the 27 one ball hole out of phase on assembly, the other two follow back to their deepest pockets still... there is the one ball to cable hook out of phase... only assembles one way. The OP phased it out. He should concur that was it.
________________________________________________
Ronnie''s Harley-Davidson''s
Ronnie's Harley-Davidson® offers service and parts, and proudly serves the areas of New Ashford, Windsor, Lenox and New Lebanon.
4 - is going to slot into 27. Both 8's are machine washers and thrust onto 7 being a needle bearing. The slinger wheel is feeding oil to the needle bearing assembly so that does not burn out. Low on oil level and the slinger emerged from it is another story.
5 - is the pushrod and inserts into 6, then 6 into 15, then 19 holds 15 into 20-left pressure plate.
6 - is turned 1/8 turn out when 27 and 28 are in their deepest setting of the two parts almost touching each other.
5 - can slide back and forth without a load. No plate is hung up or dragging as if the lever pulled in and a sloppy gap at the perch? No. Still has for sure a sloppy pushrod needing the gap taken up we start chasing N.
But the theory goes... if you can take the slack out of the perch gap, did you move the 1/8th rod sliding back and forth? Sure you did. Does the rod spin with lever pulled in or remain stationary, lever out? If the needle bearing is loaded with someone holding the clutch lever it, will it burn out or will the slinger lube it?
If you placed a .0015" feeler gauge between thrust washer 8, would there be room to lube the needle bearing? If .0015" is that cam to rocker arm gap for oil to be lubed when off each other, that's a hot engine part. With that kind of clearance, I don't see cams burning up with an oil gap that tight.
Watch the cable:
Perch - lever is pulled and you have to take that gap up. How far are we from the grip with that one move?
Pushrod - lever moves closer to the grip taking up 1/8 turn out. No more float at the rod.
Cable inner - how worn out is the pivot hole at the lever and now take that out, the lever goes farther to the grip.
Outer cables - That's 4 relax points before they square up and load... is more lever toward the grip before the pressure off the plates begin.
Signed,
N has never been easier to find.
I apologize if my post in anyway upset either of you guys. I had looked on YouTube before and couldn’t find any hands on videos of this. I just checked again & Baker has one that is just exactly what I needed....to actually watch someone do it one time. Now I understand. Appreciate y’all!
I have no clue why something like a tech post is going to upset me, nor needs an apology? This stuff is morning breakfast. It's not my bike with the problem. Now that you understand it, my descriptions should make sense now, yes? More detailed as to why the tighter lever, the farther throw to separate plates is how N is the answer, how creep is the answer, how gear grind is the answer, yes or no? I rest my plate.
Last thing I want to do here is begin to argue about a generic bike? Here is the deal, you give your answer, I'll give mine. If someone is going to work on their bike blind, then a little theory can't hurt, right?
Your opinion.
What is so different about this bike I can't walk up to a basket and put it together. You think this is a magic bike that is so different than others? Dude, you don't walk up to a multi brand dealership and say I want a job, but I only know this brand. That's you, Mr. One Brand, not me. The job is an all brand or don't even open the door parking your tools somewhere. Bought a computer bike and schooled myself as to diagnosing it. I think you better know this shit before you even open the shop manual, right?
Besides, I'm sure I helped more than one person with a tech issue. Does that count not knowing this special bike?
Mr. Wright
Knows some things
I figured you for an intelligent man, and you just proved it with your dialogue above. If you want to continue to help, do it in plain english, as you just did above. Not in the babbling nonsense that is confusing to most.
chubs
Guru
I'm NOT trying to stir the pot here, but, I would bet my bike on the fact that Mr.Wright has helped more people here with their bikes than someone who posts all the wild ideas that you seem to want to promote here. Maybe it'd help if you would do as you say and "Rest your plate" When are we gonna get to see some pics of your BigDog ?? (End of rant)
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I thought the house knew I don't own this brand. A beautiful bike, but too slow for my kind of riding. Next tech post will be less than a paragraph. Short and sweet, right? I wouldn't bet your plate on it.
Mr. Wright
Knows some things
It's spring. Lots of new guys on here trying to get on the road.
chubs
Guru
Watt ? You don't have one of these bikes ?? post up some pics of what you ride. Some of the people are into that fast action kind of riding too. Personally, I'm kinda into the dirtbike, through the woods, kind of action along with the big dog riding.
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chubs, here are few so as to prove myself and a background check if you will. My nephew caught the bug so I said, your look but flip them. He kept on scoring whatever he found. Had a profit enough to start buying his street bike of choice and then started flipping thru evo's, and the latest FXR is his current ride. Guess who built and maintained all of his shit? I took up a hobby after racing and collected 12 BSA's for parts. Sold one for 9 grand and it paid for everything plus some. Ebay timing was months away and no one knew what's an ebay? So I got 4 running and with the leftovers was one big lot sale for cheap... I was moving so didn't have the room. I kept one. So he schooled me on Harleys and do I know the engine families enough to get them wired and fired, right? Not one came back for something major. I crimped instead of soldered. A minor return. Pan to Shovel, Shovel to Evo. I can see the bottom and tops evolve thru the years as each phases in, and the other phases out. Slab to cone trivia, or what little I know about these.
This is a wicked street bike all bone stock so my background is racing, and you can't take the line and plug chop out of me. You get a sense of timing of speed so as this bike being one of the fastest bikes you can buy, I let the stang get ahead and then pulled the pin. S/he saw how fast I was coming up and decides to cut me off. Got up on her ass to push her some. I took my line and oh, look who was in the way on the apex? You'd check jetting with full redline singing and hang there, then kill the engine. You're coasting that long and such, just to get a good 'plug check.' The timing cutting the engine way down the street, I hardly touch the brakes. No brake was used for the stang, just timing.
I click big screen to watch how I ride. If I look way out ahead, I can see the line I'm setting up for next. It's the I wish what I know now about being smooth back then. That's basic old racing rules. First look way out, then be smooth, speed comes later. I was just balls out having no clue running up to point a and shoot out of point b. Now I get it. I'm not a tandem side by side rider if you noticed. Not when I practice each second. Car or bike, you can't take the line out of me. When I hide the white line I hit my apex or hang there for the next setup.
So do I qualify getting someone back on the road?
Signed,
The Basket Case
This is a wicked street bike all bone stock so my background is racing, and you can't take the line and plug chop out of me. You get a sense of timing of speed so as this bike being one of the fastest bikes you can buy, I let the stang get ahead and then pulled the pin. S/he saw how fast I was coming up and decides to cut me off. Got up on her ass to push her some. I took my line and oh, look who was in the way on the apex? You'd check jetting with full redline singing and hang there, then kill the engine. You're coasting that long and such, just to get a good 'plug check.' The timing cutting the engine way down the street, I hardly touch the brakes. No brake was used for the stang, just timing.
I click big screen to watch how I ride. If I look way out ahead, I can see the line I'm setting up for next. It's the I wish what I know now about being smooth back then. That's basic old racing rules. First look way out, then be smooth, speed comes later. I was just balls out having no clue running up to point a and shoot out of point b. Now I get it. I'm not a tandem side by side rider if you noticed. Not when I practice each second. Car or bike, you can't take the line out of me. When I hide the white line I hit my apex or hang there for the next setup.
So do I qualify getting someone back on the road?
Signed,
The Basket Case
chubs
Guru
Yeah, Whatever,,,