Clutch Travel Problems

[KaptinAmerika]

So you think it's just the way they are installing it that's giving them such a problem? I have yet to see one on any of my customers bikes. But it sounds like from what these guys are describing, it's a fine tune thing. Seems like they could build it so you just install it like you would with a Baker setup. All the Baker primarys are the same '05 and up...with the exception of the compensator addition on the 2009 models...so, why can't Bandit make a clutch that will bolt right in?

I Don't Understand The Issues
I Read The Instructions, Bolted Mine In And Was Off And Riding
I Mean THe Instructions Were Clear
For Example
They Say Don't Use Synthetic And Yet I Keep hearing That People Put Synthetic In.
Juz Sayin

 

[bigdogtech01]

I Don't Understand The Issues
I Read The Instructions, Bolted Mine In And Was Off And RIIng
I Mean THe Instructions Were Clear
For Example
They Say Don't Use Synthetic And Yet I Keep hearing That People Put Synthetic In.
Juz Sayin

Gotcha, Lol

 

[jimizee028]

I am with The Kaptain here also....I got the Bandit set-up a few weeks ago,after Andrew did my transmission and I got a new hub from Baker,did the install,followed the directions on the papers John from Bandit sent,and actually adjusted the clutch without micrometers and newfangled tools I do not own,tightened the pushrod till it just seated against throw-out,gave it a 1/4 turn,tightened it down,and I was off into the sunset....
Works fine for me....

 

[claw]

Apparently, in 2008 when the easy pull came out, they(BDM) changed the ball and ramp. You can see the difference in the photo in post # 11 on this thread. Pre "08 bikes seem to have no problem with the Bandit. "08 and later ball and ramp doesn't provide the travel that the older ones do. So on "08 and later, if you follow the clutch rod adjustment directions from Bandit, you won't have a clutch. My directions said back the rod out 1/2 turn. There is no way in hell that works on my bike. I'm just sayin.

 

[KaptinAmerika]

Good Explanation Claw
08 Was The Beginning Of The End For Performance Big Dogs And They Were Making Allot Of Alterations To Try and Prevent That Loss

 

[DoubleD]

DoubleD, after you disassemble the ball and ramp and re-grease it, it is very easy to accidently put it back on incorrectly. While the ball and ramp is apart with the clutch cable given all the slack it has in the adjuster, pull the ramp assembly all the way rearward and make sure that as you reassemble the cover plate and then go to the tranny that you do NOT pull on the cable. If you do pull on the cable it will take all the play out of the ball and ramp assemby and there will be basically NO separation when you pull on the clutch cable. It is essential that the ramp be pulled towards the rear of the bike as much as possible while replacing the cover plate and then going to the transmission. As Andrew said, adjust the pushrod into contact FIRST before touching the cable. Good luck, hopefully this is your problem and it will be an easy fix after adjusting the clutch per Andrew's instructions.

Thanks!!!!!

 

[DoubleD]

Its sounding like the easy pull may be most of my problem. Im off tomorrow and can work some more on it.

Just a couple comments

Defiantly no synthetics in the primary case.

The reason I replaced it was the slippage in 4th gear. After 2 setsof clutch discs looked for an alternative.

If there was any thing in the instructions about replacing the easy pull I missed it. But like I said that was 2010. I have just been dealing with the lurch since then and finally decided to fix it.

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions!!!

 

[Bowhunter]

Any news? When I swapped out the clutch this winter on my '09, I had to replace the ez-pull ball and ramp with the standard ball and ramp. Update when you work it out.

 

[Sven]

Step by step are the moves:

Follow bigdog's steps up to what I think is reversed are two moves. So as not to confuse, I'll give you my clutch setup theory and adjustment.

1. Steel plates are stamped out and have memory. They have a cut edge to them.
2. Frictions have a smooth and a flat side too. Make the steel and fiber flats face you and/or the pressure plate. This means if the pressure plate is the first to go in the basket, face the flats inside. In this case, we face flats out to the pressure plate.
3. Simple theory goes: Press your palms together and press your opposite fingers. See the steel side facing the non memory side? Now, lay your palm over your hand so your fingers rest on your other fingers. Move your fingers in one direction. See how they move in one direction are all the cut sides not binding you be banging gears and lurching forward?

Dog's Paraphrased:
Do 1. "Loosen your clutch cable all the way."
Do 2. "Now go back down to pushrod and turn clockwise till it just bottoms out with light drag onto the pushrod and turn counterclockwise 1/4 turn and lock jam nut down.."
Do 3. "Go back up to your clutch cable and tighten the adjuster all the way up till you have 0 (zero) play at lever while holding back on cable near housing."
Do 4. Go back up to clutch lever and make sure you have 1/16"-1/8" of free play while holding back on the cable near housing."
Do 5. "If you have close to 1/8", lock the cable down, and you are done with your adjustment."

 

[DoubleD]

Well I ended up with the exact same result. Still takes the full range of motion, still have a lurch when going from neutral to first, still very difficult to go from first or second in to neutral It's not an adjustment issue.

Anybody have the part # for the Non easy pull assembly?

 

[DoubleD]

PM Sent

I was going back through the post and saw this. That PM never made it.

 

[boomer4444]

still have it if you want it,, i also saw that bigdogpartsking threw some on ebay,,that is where claw got his,,i can send mine or buy ebay,,your choice, let me know!!

 

[jjarkys]

Well I ended up with the exact same result. Still takes the full range of motion, still have a lurch when going from neutral to first, still very difficult to go from first or second in to neutral It's not an adjustment issue.

Anybody have the part # for the Non easy pull assembly?

Ball and ramp inner and outer is listed on bdm's website under big dog parts clutches. but no year is mentioned. I would call them and ask. Unless someone else comes up with the number.

 

[claw]

Ball and ramp inner and outer is listed on bdm's website under big dog parts clutches. but no year is mentioned. I would call them and ask. Unless someone else comes up with the number.

Baker, as well as BDMPP only offer the ball and ramp for the 9 disc (easy pull) set up. I've called both. You basically have look at the difference between the two. The newer easy pull has longer ramps.

 

[Sven]

Oh yeah installed a Barnett clutch cable at the same time as the clutch.

Pull the stack of plates out. I have no clue who's clutch you installed? I know you installed a set of clutches but buy whom? Do I guess Barnett?

... still have a lurch when going from neutral to first, still very difficult to go... to neutral It's not an adjustment issue.

No shit. I mean, no shit? We have that stack out yet? Be honest, are the steels and frictions all lined up as in one direction is the cut side of the plates or stamped steels and they face you as they are installed into the big clutch basket and clutch center?

As you place all the steels in your palm and all the steels are facing one direction as in looking at a stack of pancakes, you have nothing on top of the last steel but the air pressure on it, can we see daylight between steels and sneak in some maple syrup?

See how [if] there is warp in between plates, can we see that the clutch center should stop so you do not lurch forward or can find N easy? But since the one maple syrup is sticking to the other friction, then tags the other steel, do we have enough drag going with that short throw those balls walk out of?

Stack the frictions the same way is the cut side: me repeating the same mantra is a simple move about plate installation and how you lay fingers over fingers and they move together you go bending them. But if you press your fingers like you are praying the steels and frictions are all facing the same way is not this way as you press your fingers now and they don't move but fight that memory is the one direction.

Flat needs direction. Look at a washer being stamped out. You want the most surface covered is the flat side on the bite. Round like a ball needs no direction you install those in the clutch ramp.

If ball ramp is correct; if clutch screw out is correct; if cable and perch gap are correct; if grooves in clutch outer and clutch inner are not holding plate in groove so there is no plate float slide; if-if-if we have the plates in question as we look at the grooving at the b-basket/clu-cntr = Warp plates???

Beats me??? :up:

 

[DoubleD]

Hmmm? What can I say. Must of been a good trip!!

Pull the stack of plates out. I have no clue who's clutch you installed? I know you installed a set of clutches but buy whom? Do I guess Barnett?



No shit. I mean, no shit? We have that stack out yet? Be honest, are the steels and frictions all lined up as in one direction is the cut side of the plates or stamped steels and they face you as they are installed into the big clutch basket and clutch center?

As you place all the steels in your palm and all the steels are facing one direction as in looking at a stack of pancakes, you have nothing on top of the last steel but the air pressure on it, can we see daylight between steels and sneak in some maple syrup?

See how [if] there is warp in between plates, can we see that the clutch center should stop so you do not lurch forward or can find N easy? But since the one maple syrup is sticking to the other friction, then tags the other steel, do we have enough drag going with that short throw those balls walk out of?

Stack the frictions the same way is the cut side: me repeating the same mantra is a simple move about plate installation and how you lay fingers over fingers and they move together you go bending them. But if you press your fingers like you are praying the steels and frictions are all facing the same way is not this way as you press your fingers now and they don't move but fight that memory is the one direction.

Flat needs direction. Look at a washer being stamped out. You want the most surface covered is the flat side on the bite. Round like a ball needs no direction you install those in the clutch ramp.

If ball ramp is correct; if clutch screw out is correct; if cable and perch gap are correct; if grooves in clutch outer and clutch inner are not holding plate in groove so there is no plate float slide; if-if-if we have the plates in question as we look at the grooving at the b-basket/clu-cntr = Warp plates???

Beats me??? :up:

 

[DoubleD]

Well I finally got back around to working on the bike. Getting rid of the Easy Pull ball ramp assembly was the answer. For the first time since the bike was new the clutch acts like it should. It even adjusted correctly using the Big Dog recommended procedure. I also can't really tell much different in how hard the lever is to pull. I do know I no longer have a clunk going from neutral to First and It engages at about 2/3 of the travel instead at almost completely released. I also can find neutral easily.

A big thanks to all the suggestions and comments!!!