Running out of options.. HELP!!

[Kiwirider]

Hi all.
Im back again with problems on the bike. Ive been having electrical problems on this bike for the last cpl months. 08 Mastiff EFI.

The other week my VR caught fire and my bike died. I have just replaced it with a Cycle Electric CE-320L and she starts up fine.See this thread. http://www.bigdogbiker.com/forums/general/33102-dog-catches-fire-pic.html

Only problem is the EHC LED's. This is what they look like.

Also the right front turn signal doesnt flash (is still lit, but no flash).

Ive done everything I can think of with this bike. Di Greased everything, checked earths, new VR, new battery, lives on a tender.

For a short (hours) time everything worked a while back after myself and Mickeetwo checked all the connections. See this thread.http://www.bigdogbiker.com/forums/general/32522-need-help-ehc-leds-please.html


I have a VERY important ride coming up in 10 days that I NEED this bike running. Ive already dropped a shit ton on coin into this thing so far and its starting to wear me down.:down::bang::angry:

Can anyone help me with what ALL those LED's lit means?

 

[Kiwirider]

Ok, now I figured Id remove the VR and check the earth. I took it off and and took a wire brush to the back of the VR and to where it mounts to the frame, just incase there was some film of some sort obstructing it. (I didnt disconnect the battery during this).

When I reconnected it and switched it on, all but 2 LED's lit on the EHC. I started it, shut it down, switched off. A few seconds later, switched the key on and the only 2 LED's lit were the Power and Controller On (flashing). This is how it should be (I think). The right front flasher still doesnt flash.

 

[BigDogBro1]

I think that's correct on the EHC LED's prior to starting. Does the front flasher COME ON but just doesn't flash OR nothing at all?

Could be just a connection for that flasher unit...

Go back and check the crimped wire connections at both battery terminal bolts. Sometimes they loosen up and cause wierd electrical problems because it starves the EHC and ECM of the good full power they need.

 

[Five Five]

Man Dean .... seems like you covered all the important stuff, and you probably don't want to hit the rode worrying about your EHC failing .... Kind of kills the trip

Maybe someone else will chime in with a solution :up:

You still have time to do a upgrade WP or PDM if $$$ allows

For me I would just run the shit out of it before your trip and see what she does .... build a sense of confidence or not... use hand signals if you have too

Maybe one of the forum members who have done the WP/PDM upgrade can loan you there old EHC for backup in the event of roadside failure..

 

[New Boots]

Maybe this will help some? The Schematic will have to be printed and put together; I didn’t know any other way to do it.

http://bigdog.voices-inc.com/Schematic_EFI.pdf

http://bigdog.voices-inc.com/EFI_And_Carb_EHC.pdf

http://bigdog.voices-inc.com/Connector_A_B_EFI.pdf

:flag::flag::flag:

 

[Mickeetwo]

Sorry to hear about your troubles Dean. Man you've had a rough month. I have a EHC you could use but its for a non-efi bike. Its not going to help you any. I'm with five-five, I would ride it all week and see how it goes. If it runs good all week.....I'd go on my trip.

 

[Five Five]

Hey Dean...

I received an e-mail from a good friend, who knows these bikes in and out...

it sounds as if the voltage regulator shorted, caught fire, tripped the charging breaker and now the electrical system is acting crazy!
Well, this isn't good! BDM "DID" have a recall on this very same issue.

Make: BIGDOG Model: CHOPPER, K9, MASTIFF, PITBULL, RIDGEBACK
Model Year: 2006
Manufacturer: BIG DOG MOTORCYCLES, LLC Mfr's Report Date: AUG 06, 2007
NHTSA CAMPAIGN ID Number: 07V-356 ('05-'06) ALL.pdf
N/A
NHTSA Action Number: N/A
Component: ELECTRICAL SYSTEM:ALTERNATOR/GENERATOR/REGULATOR
Summary:
ON CERTAIN MOTORCYCLES, A WARPED BUS BAR WITHIN THE VOLTAGE REGULATOR CAN CAUSE A SHORT CIRCUIT.
Consequence:
THIS COULD POSSIBLY RESULT IN A FIRE.
Remedy:
DEALERS WILL REPLACE THE EXISTING CIRCUIT BREAKER LOCATED BETWEEN THE VOLTAGE REGULATOR POSITIVE BATTERY LEAD (B+ LEAD) AND THE POSITIVE BATTERY TERMINAL WITH AN ALTERNATIVE CIRCUIT PROTECTION DEVICE THAT WILL PREVENT A THERMAL EVENT IF THERE IS A SHORT TO GROUND. THE RECALL BEGAN ON OCTOBER 1, 2007. OWNERS MAY CONTACT BIG DOG AT 1-316-219-9129 OR EMAIL TO CUSTOMER.SERVICE@BIGDOGMOTORCYCLES.COM.
Notes:
CUSTOMERS MAY ALSO CONTACT THE NATIONAL HIGHWAY TRAFFIC SAFETY ADMINISTRATION'S VEHICLE SAFETY HOTLINE AT 1-888-327-4236 (TTY 1-800-424-9153), OR GO TO HTTP://WWW.SAFERCAR.GOV.

However, it didn't apply to the '08 models.
But,......I was also of the understanding that the breaker was replaced after this incident with a "Slow-Blow" fuse and on all of the future models, as well!
But even "if" they were still using the breakers, who's to say that BDM didn't still have some laying around when this bike was assembled, right?

And fyi:
Many of the units that experienced this issue. It fried many of the EHC, because the high voltage spike got through the breaker and to the internal voltage regulator of the EHC, just before the breaker tripped!
So like I said, NOT GOOD, whatsoever!


Dean send me your e-mail addy if you want me to send you a copy of the recall, to help identify which VR were bad...

It sounds like your EHC may have incurred a high voltage spike damaging your EHC.

 

[erldawg]

I assume that you disconnected the battery when you changed the VR. On EFI bikes when the battery is disconnected you need to go through the power up sequence to reset all the sensors.
Although that may explain the EHC lites I'm not convinced this would effect the right turn signal. I'd check wires to right front turn and it's possible there may be something in the RH control board last but not least EHC hosed....

 

[minermark]

Get rid of that POS EHC, wires plus or the BDM, just do it........

 

[pknowles]

I have a ehc off my 07 efi bulldog that may work. it was working last year when I switched to the wire plus. I was having problems with my bike shutting down for no reason. Some on here seem to think that the problems lie in the wiring rather than the ehc. I don't know, but after changing to the wire plus I have been riding almost one year with out a hiccup.

 

[Brew]

Hey Dean,
chili08k9 has his EHC from his 2008 EFI K-9 up for sale if your going that route and he's selling it at a good price $200. He said nothings wrong with it just changed to the wire-plus because his ignition switch was acting up.

 

[mastiffdave]

I agree Dean just ride the heck out of it and what ever direction your goin on your ride just take all our numbers with ya as weve got the whole state covered with good members if you do have a prob.

 

[Five Five]

I agree Dean just ride the heck out of it and what ever direction your goin on your ride just take all our numbers with ya as weve got the whole state covered with good members if you do have a prob.

well said .... I have tools a few parts truck and trailer .... once you cross the state line in California... I got you covered:up:

 

[Kiwirider]

Cheers to everyone for their help and advice

Took it for a ride this arvo. Everything (except flasher) seemed to be working ok. I got into town about 4 miles away and the check engine light would come on and the engine would cut out, cough and splutter, then would come right again. It did this a few times intermittently and nothing consistent about it. I stopped at a bike shop to get some wire bundle cover and asked some advice. He told me to go through and check all my grounds, especially the main to the starter bolt and also to check the wiring around the ignition/key switch for a possible earth/short. Ill do that first light tomorrow.

Also when I left the bike shop.... The flasher was working. Everything was working, just the engine light and engine cutting out was the only problem. Had to pull over at one point and the engine died (electrics still on and working). Tried starting a few times, starter would crank, but no start. Then about the third time she started up and I came straight home. She's now on the tender and will do some more fault checking first light.:bang:

I wouldnt mind if it was the EHC, just that the problems keep changing without any provoking or changes in conditions. Its very random, thus hard to diagnose.

As your advice, Im going to ride it again tomorrow. Have a HD dealer ride/lunch with an hour each way ride tomorrow. At least if it does shit itself there will be others around to give me a push.

Ill follow up in the AM. Time for some zzz.

 

[Kiwirider]

well said .... I have tools a few parts truck and trailer .... once you cross the state line in California... I got you covered:up:

Awesome guys!! Its not an especially long ride. Just important. I have a mate from New Zealand coming over for a week and Ive sorted a loaner bike for him. Dont want to have to sort a loaner bike for me!!

Cheers for the offer of help.!!!

Coffee now :Yawn:... then outside to check the bike over.

 

[erldawg]

Awesome guys!! Its not an especially long ride. Just important. I have a mate from New Zealand coming over for a week and Ive sorted a loaner bike for him. Dont want to have to sort a loaner bike for me!!

Cheers for the offer of help.!!!

Coffee now :Yawn:... then outside to check the bike over.

Sounds like a loose or grounding wire somewhere. Double check the wires on your battery. I have a 08 EFI K9 and I have 4 wires on the negative side. I don't imagine the wiring between the models is all that different. If there is a wire dangling and intermittently grounding it may be causing your condition.

I don't think this is your problem but remember anytime you disconnect the battery u must go through the reset sensor procedure. It's under your seat on the battery box. "Turn key on hit run, turn key off for at least 15 seconds".

 

[Five Five]

Sounds like a loose or grounding wire somewhere. Double check the wires on your battery. I have a 08 EFI K9 and I have 4 wires on the negative side. I don't imagine the wiring between the models is all that different. If there is a wire dangling and intermittently grounding it may be causing your condition.

I don't think this is your problem but remember anytime you disconnect the battery u must go through the reset sensor procedure. It's under your seat on the battery box. "Turn key on hit run, turn key off for at least 15 seconds".

Good comments Earl your right on track.

 

[Five Five]

Dean ..... here is some addtional information emailed to me from a good friend...

Correct, it's an intermittent "connection" issue,..."SOMEWHERE"!
Grounds, "maybe". But remember ALL of the component ground pathways run back to one central location, the EHC, then to the battery. That with the exception to the starter motor, itself.
"IF" his electrical failures seem to be inconsistent and all over the place from one time to the next. I'd have to seriously consider "cleaning & re-dielectric greasing" the EHC serial connectors, "cleaning the battery terminals & the connection cables to the battery"!
Then I'd see where this takes me, because this should eliminate any inconsistent issues and cause some regularity to any failures, so that they can be addressed appropriately.

 

[Kiwirider]

Thanks Bill for doing some extra inquiring for me. This morning, I D/C the battery, took off the coil cover and checked the ignition connections, pulled the EHC off and re checked/re greased the serial connections, pulled the EFI controller in case the there was something in that connection. I even put a small pad under the controller connector just to make sure its seated.

Once I got it all back together, re connected the battery. Did start procedure. EVERYTHING NORMAL!! EHC lights good, turn signal works.

We got on the bike and headed into town to the HD dealer for the ride. On the way the engine still did its cut out thing. Engine light would flash on, engine would miss/cut out for a split second then come back. A second later the engine light would go off. It was running so I left it alone.

At the dealership we walked around, talked some shit and decided to go for our own ride. When I went to start her up. Key on, hit run.... Nothing!! Spoke to one of the shop guy (old school mech), he mentioned that sometimes the wiring can get "pinched" inside the hand control. Especially with the internal wiring system. So I pulled the right hand controller apart and sure enough. There are 2 wires from the brake lever that connect to the button board, they were worn to near breaking off and looked suspiciously like they were touching. They were TINY little connections. So we (myself and my lovely wife) walked of to Lowes with the parts. Brought a butane soldering iron, my pocket knife and the smallest drill bits they had (1/32? for a dremel). Them in the car park we proceeded to strip the wires off, clean the connections and re solder them back together. Actually it looks like a better job than factory. We got it back together and she started up first pop. (forgot to take pics, sorry guys)

I thought that might have been the reason for the intermittent engine cut out, but on the way home it did it again. Only once though, but once is enough.
At least the list of problems is getting smaller.

I think my next jobs as you you've mentioned Bill, will be to check more connections. Any earths or even + connections Ill pull and clean with a wire brush and see how that goes.

Slowly but surely....

 

[Brew]

It's good to hear that you're fixing problems one-by-one and getting closer to success. Look at it this way, by time you're done and everything’s running correct you will know that biotch inside and out... :2thumbs: