pushrod adjustments

[lee]

Below is an email exchange between me and S&S about my recently acquired loud ticking noise. Might be of use to someone. Bear in mind, this stuff relates to lifters with travel limiters. As its an email train you need to read from the bottom up



Once you shorten the pushrods so that you can rotate them with your finger, the plunger is bottomed out on the travel limiter spacer and the valve is back on the seat. (We call this zero lash). The reason that it doesn't feel the same as zero lash when you start the adjustment process is that you are fighting the pressure of the spring beneath the plunger in the lifter, so what you describe is accurate. According to your initial e-mail, you did the adjustment properly!

Dean Young II, Technical Support, S&S Cycle Inc, 14025 County Highway G, Viola, WI 54664, Direct Line: 608-627-0227
Drawings, models, & information transmitted within this email are proprietary designs and information of S&S Cycle, Inc., and may not either in whole or part be transmitted, reproduced, used, or disclosed without the expressed written consent of: S&S Cycle, Inc., 14025 County Highway G, Viola, WI 54664


-----Original Message-----
From: Chappell, Lee (UK - Bristol) [mailto:lchappell@deloitte.co.uk]
Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 2010 2:54 AM
To: Young Dean
Subject: RE: Web Request Technical Support : engine tick

Thanks very much Dean. One other question if I may? When you shorten the rods until you can rotate with your fingers, I do remember that in particular with the intake rods I could loosen with my fingers but not tighten - should I have loosened some more, effectively to zero lash I guess, and then loosen the extra complete turn?

Just out of interest, how long would you expect lifters to last? these were brand new 12-18 months ago.

Thanks for your help Dean - very much appreciated

-----Original Message-----
From: Young Dean [mailto:dyoung@sscycle.com]
Sent: 25 October 2010 17:09
To: Chappell, Lee (UK - Bristol)
Subject: RE: Web Request Technical Support : engine tick

Your adjustment sounds correct. You may want to shorten the pushrods 1/2 turn and see if the noise goes away. If it doesn't, and you have good oil pressure, you may need new lifters.

Dean Young II, Technical Support, S&S Cycle Inc, 14025 County Highway G, Viola, WI 54664, Direct Line: 608-627-0227
Drawings, models, & information transmitted within this email are proprietary designs and information of S&S Cycle, Inc., and may not either in whole or part be transmitted, reproduced, used, or disclosed without the expressed written consent of: S&S Cycle, Inc., 14025 County Highway G, Viola, WI 54664


-----Original Message-----
From: lchappell@deloitte.co.uk [mailto:lchappell@deloitte.co.uk]
Sent: Sunday, October 24, 2010 11:28 AM
To: Tech Mail
Subject: Web Request Technical Support : engine tick


From : Lee Chappell
e-Mail : lchappell@deloitte.co.uk
Subject : Web Request Technical Support : engine tick

Message :
I have a 117 Super Sidewinder + with the HL2T S&S lifters. Lately there is a much more pronounced tick. I adjusted the pushrods like so - collapsed rods, waited 10 mins, found zero lash then extended rods 4 complete turns, waited 20-30 mins. Shortened rod til moveable by hand, loosened 1 complete turn. Can you suggest any different adjustment to reduce the tick please? I see in the tech tip is says to collapse lifter so piston is in contact with spacer - how do you know when this happens??
Many thanks
Lee

 

[MARV]

so....

did the 1/2 turn make a difference?

 

[woodbutcher]

like tellin' a joke and walkin' away without givin' the punch line.:bang::bang::bang:

 

[chacha]

Good exchange Lee - I've found 1/2 turns make a difference with noise and wear. S&S calls for lifter replacement at 25,000 -- though I think they can last much longer. I changed my then and sold the old ones as used...they had more life in them for someone :up:

 

[lee]

yeah sorry fellas I haven't done the extra half turn yet. Be the weekend now. I'll let you know how it goes. Chach - I reckon I got 3 - 5,000 miles on these lifters. Something aint right.

 

[V]

Lee I didn't have limiters in mine but had one go out on my 05 Pit with about 4000 miles. Raised holy hell. It was the front intake. I replaced the the front intake and exhaust. blew out the the two with air and the front pushed out shit that looked like grease. Lifter screen was always clean

 

[chacha]

V - brings up a good point. Before swapping them --or thinking you need to--pulling them and cleaning them out is worth the time. They have some close tolerances and are pretty easy to pull apart -- though getting to them can be a pain if you don't have EZ adjust pushrods....

 

[V]

And now would be a good time for "Timesaver pushrods" if you don't already have them! S&S are the easiest I have found to work with but the Crane "Timesavers" are a little larger diameter/stronger (9MM) and are threaded to the end. Have used both using the S&S now with a .590 woods cam but if went over .600 I would go to the Crane.

The Crane "Timesavers" are 3 turns = .120
The S&S are 4 turns = .125

Please correct me if I be wrong and shit

 

[lee]

thanks gents - so if I was to get the time savers I just cut out the pushrods I have now and there will be no need to take the rocker boxes off? I've never taken the lifters out myself - is there much to it?

 

[V]

Easy to do and you can leave the top end alone. Best way is a set of heavy bolt cutters. This helps to prevent metal debris from getting down on top of the lifters. The 4 bolts that hold the tappet block down are llisted as 1/4" but the next size up metric may work better due to the chrome coating. Remove bolts, maybe have to tap the blot to break the gasket seal and she's loose.

 

[RRRUFF]

V can't you pull the lifter with a magnet or do you have to pull the lifter guides?

 

[V]

V can't you pull the lifter with a magnet or do you have to pull the lifter guides?

No sir, the roller wheel on the lifter is larger than the bore on Evo stlyle lifters.:bang: I think you can on Twin Cam thou. But that doesn't help us here. There is I believe a kit available to put Twin cam lifters in a evo but haven't seen one myself.

When removing out tappet blocks it is good to have a magnet or something to hold them in the lifter block when you pull it. that way you can match the lifter and orientation to its existing bore.

 

[lee]

thanks a lot Virgil. I'll see what the 1/2 turn adjustment does and take it from there

 

[RRRUFF]

Thanks V, Lee let us know how it turns out.

 

[lee]

did the half turn - no good. Took it to Andy for another problem I've got and he stuck a camera probe into the spark plug hole and it looks as though the piston in the rear cylinder is making contact with the head and thats what the noise is. Could be a gasket problem or could be something more sinister (main bearing). Been one thing after another after another for a while now. Trans bolts sheared causing all sorts of shit, head gasket went caused by cylinder studs pulling out of the cases, side cover disappeared on a ride (I had to laugh at that one - I'm making new one out of steel - that could be even funnier!), and now this.

I'm not saying all Big Dogs are shit because I know they're not and I'm not Big Dog bashing here in any shape or form but this one certainly lives up to its name - its a dog.... Oh well, fuck it. Its only a bike

 

[V]

That suks Lee. If I was there i'd buy ya a ale or 6. Keep us posted. V

 

[chacha]

Sorry to hear of the cascading problems...at least it's the season for repairing...

 

[Five Five]

Sorry to Hear Lee......had my front rod bearing go out at 28K ...still trying to figure out the failure mode Talked to Dean at S&S and he ran the case numbers....said no recalls for my 107 he said my motor was sold to BD as a kit.....so anything could of happened during the motor build.

:2thumbs:
"Five"

 

[lee]

thanks fellas. Its actually never occurred to me that my motor may not have been built by S&S. Could explain a few things

 

[lee]

well I got the bike back Saturday - now £730 lighter. New gaskets to give piston to head clearance - dropped compression a bit but bike is nicer to ride. Tranny completely broken down and checked and all in perfect working order - thank Christ for that. Rear wheel respaced and entire drive line realigned to include resetting the swing arm. New rings and pistons re cross hatched. Rear bolt on the clutch actuator cover was being pulled out so insert put in along with longer bolts to stop the flexing. Gallons of loctite on the tranny mounting bolts cus they keep coming loose and fucking shit up.

Bike definitely runs a lot smoother now and you can get on the gas without a shit load of juddering and the belt is tracking much better on the trans pulley. All I need to do now is try to make a couple of new side covers and I might be able to enjoy riding the dog again. Fingers crossed.