Presumed EHC failure that actually was not the issue

[Nukeranger]

I think the EHC is blamed for more failures than it should be , but I have no scientific proof of this. And just to let you know a little about my background I have been an electronic tech for 35 years working mainly in the low voltage field. I spend hours a day diagnosing wiring, component and software related electrical problems.

The two things that have shut my bike down so far was an incorrectly programmed EHC (that was fixed by BDPP reprogramming the EHC) and the other problem that the EHC shutdown for was a loose sparkplug terminal cap. Plugwire came off and the EHC wont let the engine run on one cylinder. That didn't give me a good feeling when it died. I used red locktite to hold the little screw-on plugcaps on now.

Anyway, during the diagnosis of the first problem I went through most of the wire routing in the battery area. There were several places that could have and would have caused a short in the wiring given enough time. One blatant example was two of the tail light wires running under the seat and being crushed by the seat. It hadn't failed yet , but it would have and the ehc could have been blamed for the problem. I also noted several places around the battery box with sharp edges with critical wires rubbing on them. Another spot for failure, so I put some additional insulation in these areas to prevent future failures. I also rerouted wiring around lower engine area, as it was just done in a sloppy manor from the factory. Even though it has nothing to do with the wiring, I found the fuel line rubbing on the coil housing, and it was already worn half way through in only 500 miles, again sloppy assembly.

I haven,t been under the tank yet or into the wiring in bars (scared to look) but I suspect there are places there that need attention also. The guy that designed the EHC probably had a fairly good idea on paper. The EHC may work great for an occasional short but I bet if that "short" pulses at 3-4,000 times a minute for an extended period a component in the EHC will give up.

Even though I haven't done it and hope not too, it looks like replacing the EHC with the PDM or the WP version requires a lot of rewiring of the existing harness. During this rewiring process I suspect a lot of problems that were blamed on the EHC alone were really wiring problems somewhere else that were eliminated during the retrofit with the new wiring. And all the crimp connectors....fine when new but after corrosion and vibration has set in there is a potential for a problem. They should be soldered. All this being said, the EHC still could be crap. Without having one to dissect, and hard to do the way they are made, we may never know if they are the cause of the problem, or fail as a result of another problem.

Sorry for the long post, just some of my thoughts.

I like the way you think. I just replaced my Braille assuming low voltage was the culprit even though the load test was ok. I haven't had an issue yet. I am also afraid to look under the tank but it is on the list of things to do. Normally, the failures are either the battery, battery connections, short, or ignition switch. I do have WP in standby but my EHC is not the problem from what I can tell.

 

[RRRUFF]

I wasn't having any problems with mine just wanted something more reliable and water resistant.

 

[Nukeranger]

You can make your EHC more water resistant!

 

[minermark]

I treat EHC's like an exwife, as long as it stay's out of my life , i will not shoot it.....

 

[BadBrad]

I wasn't having any problems with mine just wanted something more reliable and water resistant.

Same here RRRuFF. The worst thing I've read and experienced with the EHC is the snowballing affect it has on all electricals. It doesn't just cut out one thing. Generally, there are several components that all fail at once. I just want to ride and not worry about a finicky solid state EHC.

 

[KnotSo]

I wasn't having any problems with mine just wanted something more reliable and water resistant.

Except perhaps for RAYWOOD, i DOUBT MANY RIDE THEIR DOG IN MORE RAIN CONDITIONS THAN I DO, AND i WASH IT WITH HOT SUDSY WATER AFTER THOSE RIDES (COVERING THE LIGHTS, CONTROLS AND BATTERY/ELECTRONIS AREA WITH LATEX GLOVES AND SUCH), AND HAVE NEVER DONE ANY WATERPROOFING, 'CEPT FOR SEALING THE HEADLIGHT WHEN THE HID WENT IN AND HAVE YET TO HAVE ANY WATER RELATED ELECTRICAL ISSUES. AND I BOUGHT THE SCOOT BRAND NEW.
THE BIKE IS ALL STOCK CEPT FOR AFTERMARKET OIL AND AIR FILTERS. THERE ARE SEVERAL BIG DOG RIDERS IN THE NW THAT JUST ACCEPT THAT RIDING IN RAIN SHOULD NOT BE AN ISSUE AND THINK NOTHING OF IT. opps, not yelling, I do work stuff in cap locks.
Anyway, these are my thoughts and what not (and today is a snow day)

 

[chihuasbigdog]

I wasn't having any problems with mine just wanted something more reliable and water resistant.

Except perhaps for RAYWOOD, i DOUBT MANY RIDE THEIR DOG IN MORE RAIN CONDITIONS THAN I DO, AND i WASH IT WITH HOT SUDSY WATER AFTER THOSE RIDES (COVERING THE LIGHTS, CONTROLS AND BATTERY/ELECTRONIS AREA WITH LATEX GLOVES AND SUCH), AND HAVE NEVER DONE ANY WATERPROOFING, 'CEPT FOR SEALING THE HEADLIGHT WHEN THE HID WENT IN AND HAVE YET TO HAVE ANY WATER RELATED ELECTRICAL ISSUES. AND I BOUGHT THE SCOOT BRAND NEW.
THE BIKE IS ALL STOCK CEPT FOR AFTERMARKET OIL AND AIR FILTERS. THERE ARE SEVERAL BIG DOG RIDERS IN THE NW THAT JUST ACCEPT THAT RIDING IN RAIN SHOULD NOT BE AN ISSUE AND THINK NOTHING OF IT. opps, not yelling, I do work stuff in cap locks.
Anyway, these are my thoughts and what not (and today is a snow day)

:bang::bang::bang: no shit!!!
i havent had any issues riding in the rain and have NEVER cover the lights or the controls or else when ive washed the dog.
(besides the neutral light on for the first 2 hours after washing it:loony

 

[Brew]

:bang::bang::bang: no shit!!!
i havent had any issues riding in the rain and have NEVER cover the lights or the controls or else when ive washed the dog.
(besides the neutral light on for the first 2 hours after washing it:loony

I'm with ya Chihua, I don't cover the controls or lights but i do take my seat off and cover the speedo and battery compartment with plastic covering. The only reason i cover the speedo is because of the fogging issue this helps lessen that issue. I like you and Knotso wash with warm soapy water. I'm going to try this Dri wash stuff and see how that works!

 

[Fibersnake]

Also wash my bike with very little issue. With the old BD Speedometer I would get fogging and sometimes the annuciator ring lights would dance for a little bit, but stop after a few miles and heat getting to it.

Since going to DD for speedometer, no fogging issue, and sprayed water proofing spray on the bottom of the anniciator ring and have had no issue since.

Many many rides in rain (and shared with more than a few on here).

Less concern for water now that I have changed to PDM, we will see.

 

[MYBIKEKICKSASS]

Smartest move anyone owning a big dog could make is to replace the wiring completely on the bike as I did. What I did is had the wiring color coded to Harley wiring ran through the frame of the bike then you run the wiring to a cancell box for your directionals and to a brain box which is basically were all your relays and your fuse is etc. EHC MODULES ON BIG DOGS AND WIRING HARNESS'S ( SUCK ) need I say more.

 

[BigDickPitBull]

im at almost 20,000 miles. Double in 1 year as to the first 2 owners and have not had any issues. I ride her in the rain. I will need new tires soon though

 

[BBChopper]

I still have the original with no USB, I have issues but with the manual starter plunger which I love I don’t care! I just roll the Dice every time I start her up!!!:2thumbs:

 

[minermark]

Next thursday 29th i get mine back, new wiring and NO DAM EHC.......

 

[minermark]

So here is my update, when i had the dog flatbeded into the shop some WEEKS back,don did not know witch module we could get the fastest wires plus and BDM were three weeks out, turned out, more like five,BDM module came through first so that's what it is.
To date, iv have a bike, ZERO problems so far, been raining like hell in norcal for the past two weeks however this sat on, 70s and dry.
Only got to ride maybe two days for an hour, but let me tell you after a year of shit, i think some major barhopping is in order.....

 

[Mojo]

I think the EHC is blamed for more failures than it should be , but I have no scientific proof of this. And just to let you know a little about my background I have been an electronic tech for 35 years working mainly in the low voltage field. I spend hours a day diagnosing wiring, component and software related electrical problems.

I was Tech Support at BDM for their last 7 1/2 years. We replaced so many EHC's that were not faulty that I had to call the dealer/service center every time an EHC was requested in order to troubleshoot and confirm that it needed replaced. After only a few short months, our analysts told me that EHC replacement had dropped 300%. I can say with confidence that 90% of the time I called, the EHC was either not at fault, or something else had caused the EHC failure Unfortunately, electrical seems to intimidate a large majority of mechanics. Since the EHC was unfamiliar territory for many, it was the easiest to blame. I was actually nicknamed the EHC Nazi by a co-worker (after the Soup Nazi from Seinfeld). Not saying they did not fail, but it was actually a very low percentage.

 

[stlmikie]

You just verified what I thought all along.

I was Tech Support at BDM for their last 7 1/2 years. We replaced so many EHC's that were not faulty that I had to call the dealer/service center every time an EHC was requested in order to troubleshoot and confirm that it needed replaced. After only a few short months, our analysts told me that EHC replacement had dropped 300%. I can say with confidence that 90% of the time I called, the EHC was either not at fault, or something else had caused the EHC failure Unfortunately, electrical seems to intimidate a large majority of mechanics. Since the EHC was unfamiliar territory for many, it was the easiest to blame. I was actually nicknamed the EHC Nazi by a co-worker (after the Soup Nazi from Seinfeld). Not saying they did not fail, but it was actually a very low percentage.

 

[KnotSo]

You just verified what I thought all along.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Mojo
I was Tech Support at BDM for their last 7 1/2 years. We replaced so many EHC's that were not faulty that I had to call the dealer/service center every time an EHC was requested in order to troubleshoot and confirm that it needed replaced. After only a few short months, our analysts told me that EHC replacement had dropped 300%. I can say with confidence that 90% of the time I called, the EHC was either not at fault, or something else had caused the EHC failure Unfortunately, electrical seems to intimidate a large majority of mechanics. Since the EHC was unfamiliar territory for many, it was the easiest to blame. I was actually nicknamed the EHC Nazi by a co-worker (after the Soup Nazi from Seinfeld). Not saying they did not fail, but it was actually a very low percentage.

MOJO, thank you for the positive clarification:2thumbs: This is what many of us have thought. Also want to Thank You for your Support of BDM and the owners of these fine scoots:flag::2thumbs:

Stmikie, I concur:flag::2thumbs:
__________________

 

[stlmikie]

So basically BigDog could have gone under because of incompetent mech. work. The millions of dollars thrown down the tubes at false ehc issues. Mojo, if it makes you feel any better I guess I would consider myself an ehc nazi.

 

[Sven]

After only a few short months, our analysts told me that EHC replacement had dropped 300%. I can say with confidence that 90% of the time I called, the EHC was either not at fault, or something else had caused the EHC failure Unfortunately, electrical seems to intimidate a large majority of mechanics. Since the EHC was unfamiliar territory for many, it was the easiest to blame.

300% is amazing. I know in hindsight, the ones you sent never returned. That says about 300% found the problem holding a 'good known unit' in hand. :roll:

It is not funny, but you gotta remember, this is forever on the rotation of mechanics no matter where. It is WATT it is.

 

[Nukeranger]

Interesting. Yesterday, I removed my gas tank and ignition cover to check for frayed wires. There is one plug-in connector under the tank and one under the ignition switch. Both seemed fine as well as the ignition switch. I thought about cutting and soldering the connectors but didn't. The key switch was good. So, I put everything back like before but took some stress out of the plug under the tank. As an aside, I wrapped all the tank grommets to take out the gas tank vibrations which bugged me.

What was interesting is that I was able to quickly disconnect and reconnect a plug with the ignition on and get the EHC to light up like a tree. This has been my only issue. This is an EHC reboot like a loss of power. More investigation to come!

Just so you know, my bike does this every day. So, what I do is pull in the clutch, cycle the key switch, press Run, and then start. It happens once a day and I am getting used to it. I am determined to figure it out. I want to figure it out vice using the Easter egg approach. I think I am fairly certain that the EHC is losing power but it is very specific. It has to be more than a nano second but less than a second.