HELP WITH PDM INSTALL
- Thread starter 07bigdog
- Start date
bearman
Active Member
Ok now we are getting somewhere.
The light on the Ingition should start blinking while the starter is spinning the motor.
Does the light on the ignition module come back on after you release the start button? Or do you have to press the run button again for it to come back on?
The light on the Ingition should start blinking while the starter is spinning the motor.
Does the light on the ignition module come back on after you release the start button? Or do you have to press the run button again for it to come back on?
Last edited:
bearman
Active Member
The relay in the HCI must ground the red Starter relay/ignition wire (which is connected to the green wire through the relay) when off, thus the green light showing continuity to ground before the run button is pressed.
Adding a diode to the green wire shouldl either make the starter run all the time or do nothing.
The ignition module wire and the starter relay wire are supposed to be connected at the HCI connector so they should have the same voltage potential before the start button is pressed.
There is a possibility that the ignition module likely needs a higher voltage than the starter relay does to operate and that the HCI is bad and cannot pass a high enough voltage and current at the same time to operate both the starter relay and the ignition module without the run button being pressed.
You can remedy this with a low current draw relay (just like the start relay) use the existing wire going to the ignition module power the coil side of the relay (with the other side of the coil going to ground) and run a fused 12v from the battery to the common side of the switched contacts and connect the normally open side of the switched contacts to the ignition. This should make it work like normal. A good way to do this would be to install a parallel a relay just like the start relay, right next to the start relay and jump (piggyback) the red and green wire from the PDM to the same place on the new relay. Connect the new coil ground (where the green wire from the harness would be) to the black ground wire on the old one, and finally use the last contact (where the black wire would be on the new relay) to power the ignition.
The need for low current draw relays is that our hand control circuit boards can only handle about 1.25 watts (0.25 amp(250mA) at 5 volts or about 0.1 amp at 12v). Typically 12 volt relays like the one in the PDM that operates the solenoid, draws about 1.8 watts (0.15 amp at 12v) but has 30 amps capacity contacts. The HCI circuit board probably has the same max current as the hand controls. Typically for a 12 volt relay that has less than 1.25watt current draw the contacts are only rated for about 10 amps max. These are usually circuit board relays (but not micro relays).
Or you could just power the ignition from the running lights (not the headlight, but any other wire that is hot only when the key is on but does not turn off when you hit the start button) but then you have to turn the key off to stop the motor.
If the green wire from the PDM is hot only when the key is on then you could power the ignition from that wire.
Another option is to have the HCI repaired locally (if BDM can repair it, thens so can someone else), you know which wire is having an output problem and which wire feeds it, so it should be easy to replace that micro relay on the circuit board.
Adding a diode to the green wire shouldl either make the starter run all the time or do nothing.
The ignition module wire and the starter relay wire are supposed to be connected at the HCI connector so they should have the same voltage potential before the start button is pressed.
There is a possibility that the ignition module likely needs a higher voltage than the starter relay does to operate and that the HCI is bad and cannot pass a high enough voltage and current at the same time to operate both the starter relay and the ignition module without the run button being pressed.
You can remedy this with a low current draw relay (just like the start relay) use the existing wire going to the ignition module power the coil side of the relay (with the other side of the coil going to ground) and run a fused 12v from the battery to the common side of the switched contacts and connect the normally open side of the switched contacts to the ignition. This should make it work like normal. A good way to do this would be to install a parallel a relay just like the start relay, right next to the start relay and jump (piggyback) the red and green wire from the PDM to the same place on the new relay. Connect the new coil ground (where the green wire from the harness would be) to the black ground wire on the old one, and finally use the last contact (where the black wire would be on the new relay) to power the ignition.
The need for low current draw relays is that our hand control circuit boards can only handle about 1.25 watts (0.25 amp(250mA) at 5 volts or about 0.1 amp at 12v). Typically 12 volt relays like the one in the PDM that operates the solenoid, draws about 1.8 watts (0.15 amp at 12v) but has 30 amps capacity contacts. The HCI circuit board probably has the same max current as the hand controls. Typically for a 12 volt relay that has less than 1.25watt current draw the contacts are only rated for about 10 amps max. These are usually circuit board relays (but not micro relays).
Or you could just power the ignition from the running lights (not the headlight, but any other wire that is hot only when the key is on but does not turn off when you hit the start button) but then you have to turn the key off to stop the motor.
If the green wire from the PDM is hot only when the key is on then you could power the ignition from that wire.
Another option is to have the HCI repaired locally (if BDM can repair it, thens so can someone else), you know which wire is having an output problem and which wire feeds it, so it should be easy to replace that micro relay on the circuit board.
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07bigdog
07BIGDOG
I have to press the run button again. Every once and a while the module will stay on and bike will start. Maybe once out of 6 times. With test light in the wire, it works every time.
bearman
Active Member
It does make sense to me now that the HCI could be bad.
I think the Ignition is shutting down because of low voltage, and while it may not be getting hardly any current from the meter it still may be getting voltage from the test meter and therefore still working when the meter is used. I would be interested to know what the voltage readings would be with a digital multimeter instead of a LED test light.
I think that maybe the contacts on the micro latching relay in the HCI are burnt and can't pass good enough voltage and/or current to work both circuits unless the run button is pressed.
The Ignition probably shuts itself down at 8 to 10 volts and the relay is probably good down to about 4 volts. The relay in the harness is a low current draw relay and is really an intermediate relay because the bigger starter relay in the PDM draws more current than the circuit board in the HCI can handle, but the contacts in the intermediate relay (and the micro relay) can't handle the current needed for the solenoid.
I edited possible solutions in the post above.
I think the Ignition is shutting down because of low voltage, and while it may not be getting hardly any current from the meter it still may be getting voltage from the test meter and therefore still working when the meter is used. I would be interested to know what the voltage readings would be with a digital multimeter instead of a LED test light.
I think that maybe the contacts on the micro latching relay in the HCI are burnt and can't pass good enough voltage and/or current to work both circuits unless the run button is pressed.
The Ignition probably shuts itself down at 8 to 10 volts and the relay is probably good down to about 4 volts. The relay in the harness is a low current draw relay and is really an intermediate relay because the bigger starter relay in the PDM draws more current than the circuit board in the HCI can handle, but the contacts in the intermediate relay (and the micro relay) can't handle the current needed for the solenoid.
I edited possible solutions in the post above.
07bigdog
07BIGDOG
Checked the wiring again on my PDM. The wiring on the run start relay is black, with red just below, then green and green. My wiring schematic shows black,green,green,red. Black=ground, green=R/H H/C, green=HCI, red=HCI. Are the wires on my run start relay in the wrong position or is the wiring schematic wrong?
bearman
Active Member
I doubt the wires are in the wrong position (since your starting system seems to function correctly when you press the start button), it doesn't matter how the wires are arranged on the schemattic, you're supposed to have 2 greens, 1 red, and 1 black, and that's what you say you have. Although you said one of the greens went to the HCI, it should go to the PDM.
I did some checking and some of those low current draw relays (like the run start relay) will still energize down to about 6 volts, but once energized will not de-energize (or drop-out) till about 1.5 volts. So I am still betting that your problem is a low voltage problem from the HCI.
07bigdog
07BIGDOG
When i have the low and peen test light hooked up (positive and negative sides of battery) and the test probe stuck into the wire at the run start relay the ignition module will not kickout when i press the start button. As soon as i remove the probe from the wire and press start, the ignition module will kick off?
07bigdog
07BIGDOG
Worked on the PDM system again today to try and get past the defective HCI. Installed 2 resisters. One 680 ohm and one 56 ohm resister and a led light. They run from the green wire going to the HCI and to the ground wire on the run start relay. Everything is working now. Ignition module stays on when start button pressed.
bearman
Active Member
I’m glad it works for you.
The wiring diagram I have has a green wire to the PDM and one to the Run/Start button. If you connected the green run/start wire to the black wire (ground) through the resistors and led, you are basically back-feeding the ignition from the black wire with a tiny amount of current (something like 0.1 watts). This will only work if you do not have a perfect ground between the connection on the black wire and the battery. The voltage potential between the black wire and the negative side of the battery should be zero (even when starting). So it shouldn’t work for you, since it does work, it makes me think you don’t have a good connection to ground on that black wire, and that it may have been part of your problem all along.
Ride it till it breaks.
The wiring diagram I have has a green wire to the PDM and one to the Run/Start button. If you connected the green run/start wire to the black wire (ground) through the resistors and led, you are basically back-feeding the ignition from the black wire with a tiny amount of current (something like 0.1 watts). This will only work if you do not have a perfect ground between the connection on the black wire and the battery. The voltage potential between the black wire and the negative side of the battery should be zero (even when starting). So it shouldn’t work for you, since it does work, it makes me think you don’t have a good connection to ground on that black wire, and that it may have been part of your problem all along.
Ride it till it breaks.
BigDog2005_chopper
Member
hi,
i have the pdm installed as well. It was done by a shop tho.
Would you happen to have a copy of all the scamatics?
If by chance, could you send to
neal.maccallum@gmail.com
I"M trying to trouble shooot why real blinkers NOT flashing.
ty in adv.
Neal.
i have the pdm installed as well. It was done by a shop tho.
Would you happen to have a copy of all the scamatics?
If by chance, could you send to
neal.maccallum@gmail.com
I"M trying to trouble shooot why real blinkers NOT flashing.
ty in adv.
Neal.