Bike dying for no reason?

[cdogg556]

Like Ray said it's going to be one of two circuts
1) Fuel
2) Electrical

When it dies and the key is still on, can you access the "EHC"
to view the "LED" fault indicator lights ?

here is a picture of the standard "EHC" with 14 LED lites ...The upgraded "EHC" has 18 LED lites

Thanks Five-Five, I will definatally check it out, my green light is above the yellow on my bike, mine is an 05, so I don't know if it is the same as an 06, I am going to run a hot wire directly to the coil so I can bypass the EHC for now and see if that works, if so then I guess it is time to install a new controller.

 

[cdogg556]

He would start it with the seat off and jiggle the plugs around the ehc. One particular plug caused the bike to die. He put zip ties around the plug and ehc to keep them tight.

Thanks stlmikie, I will do that for sure.

 

[Nukeranger]

I would check each of the crimped wires at the battery first for a good connection. And just because the wire is firmly held by the crimp doesn't count. You probably have a higher than normal resistance between the crimp and wire which is intermittently shutting down the EHC.

The way I found mine was to use a soldering iron and hold it against the wire and see if you get a good flow of solder between the wire and crimp. I found one crimp with high resistance, cut it off, re-crimped it and haven't had another shutdown.

BTW - Crimps are used since soldered connections can break if not supported under constant vibration.

 

[cdogg556]

I would check each of the crimped wires at the battery first for a good connection. And just because the wire is firmly held by the crimp doesn't count. You probably have a higher than normal resistance between the crimp and wire which is intermittently shutting down the EHC.

The way I found mine was to use a soldering iron and hold it against the wire and see if you get a good flow of solder between the wire and crimp. I found one crimp with high resistance, cut it off, re-crimped it and haven't had another shutdown.

BTW - Crimps are used since soldered connections can break if not supported under constant vibration.

Will do Nukeranger, are you saying to go ahead and solder the all the connections at the battery?

 

[Nukeranger]

I added a little solder to the ring lug side with each one disconnected when checking for a good connection. That is how I found the high resistance since it didn't want to conduct heat. If you do this (and I did), just be careful about the solder flowing to the wire side because it can break. Although, you can put heat shrink or electrical tape on the wire side and this will provide support. You might be able to see the solder in the following picture. BTW, I was just adding the solder to see if it conducted heat so I will not claim this to be my best work solder wise since that was not the point. I can solder the shit out of electrical PC boards!

 

[Th3InfamousI]

Thanks Ray, I will do that, as far as a manuel, I don't have one, never got it with the bike when I bought it, anyway I will check the troubleshooting guide also, hey Ray, what do you think of just directly running power to the coil from the battery to see if it will run like that? if it does then I would know it's the EHC, right?

Before you start trying to hotwire anything, I would recommend you start from square one. I was in the same mode as you are and just wanted to bypass EHC so I could get back on the road, not thinking things through clearly.

Can you confirm what lights on the EHC light up for us in the below scenarios?

1. What lights are on when you turn key?
2. What about when you hit the Run button on the handlebars?
3. After bike runs and dies what lights are lit up?

Let's start with those. I got an 04, my lights are a bit different so hopefully someone might be able to say with more confidence. Also, what about the light on the ignition module?

Now just so you know if you run a hot wire to coils your bike still won't run. Don't forget you have an ignition module that you will have to deal with.:up:

Take your time, plenty of help on here to solve it!:up:

Here is your Fault Light Diagram!

 

[BigDogBro1]

Sounds like an intermittent wire connection... i.e. power or ground. Like mentioned earlier, I had loose crimps on the small wires to the battery + and -. The smaller wires with the ring-tounge connectors were the problem. The loose crimps were causing power interruption to the EHC and my S&S EFI ignition module. Once the crimps were tight and solid the shutdown problem never occured again.

The EHC LED's were crazy nonsense or none at all when the bike would die.

Common sense, troubleshooting and the process of ellimination prevailed......not EHC replacement.

 

[cdogg556]

I am going nuts trying to figure this out! damd I hate electrical problems!! if anyone feels like helping out here is my #916-220-0303, thanks.....John

 

[Nakashianr]

i put to

Check the simple things first. One item that caused a lot of problems was the EPA check valve in the gas tank cap. Its hex shaped and a lot of them caused a vacum, thus the bike would cut off from lack of fuel. Ride the bike and if it starts to die loosen the gas cap typically on the right hand side. If the bike runs its the simple check valve. Either way its good to remove this as they have been a problem to many including myself.

Wow! That's exactly what happened to me today! I had just filled up with gas, and after a few other checks, I put two and two together and opened up the gas gap and bingo I was back in action.
Don't try to tighten the gas cap after after it starts clicking.

 

[reloaderbmg]

then it dies do you lose tach,[tach goes to o before engine stops]?

 

[cdogg556]

I am going nuts trying to figure this out! damd I hate electrical problems!! if anyone feels like helping out here is my #916-220-0303, thanks.....John

Just want everyone to know that I finally got it running by bypassing the EHC, Moespeeds called me and explained how I needed to run the power from the battery to the ignition module and cut the power from the EHC, after I did that it ran fine, that will work for now, but I guess it is time to install a new PDM, anyway I just want to thank everyone who tried to help out, this is what is awsome about this board, the information here is priceless!

 

[52hammer]

I had a similar problem. Bike would just go dead - no electrics at all. Happened to me on the New Jersey Turnpike and scared the shit out of me. Turned out my ignition key was badly worn, (the bike is 8 years old) and wasn't making contact. Penn Jersey Cycles replaced the ignition and now she runs like a charm. It did require boring out the cover to accept the new ignition setup, but I now have a longer, larger key which should last longer than the original. At the time, I had 3 keys on one ring, the ignition key, a rotor lock key and the key to my garage. Since my ignition is mounted on the side, Penn Jersey told me that I should keep the ignition key separate from other keys or fobs as they tend to drag. Sometimes it's the most obvious things we miss. If your key seems loose in the ignition, that could be all it is.

 

[cdogg556]

Finally got it!

Well I just have to say "Thank You" to all of you who have helped me out on this one, I am so amazed at how everyone here comes together when someone is in need of help, it is truly amazing!, anyway I finally got it figured out after Moespeeds, (whom is unbelievably smart) called me and explained the way the ignition works to me, after that is was fairly simple, just install a new power sorce to the ignition, well that worked great, except that my battery would not stay charged, well I am thinking I screwed something up so I started looking a the wiring schematic and realized that there is a 40 amp inline fuse between the alt and the battery, well when I went and checked it I found that it had blown, probabally because I did not disconnect the battery while I was installing the new power to the ignition, anyway I belive it is "finally" worked out, so just wanted to say thanks again for all the help!:2thumbs:

 

[cdogg556]

I had a similar problem. Bike would just go dead - no electrics at all. Happened to me on the New Jersey Turnpike and scared the shit out of me. Turned out my ignition key was badly worn, (the bike is 8 years old) and wasn't making contact. Penn Jersey Cycles replaced the ignition and now she runs like a charm. It did require boring out the cover to accept the new ignition setup, but I now have a longer, larger key which should last longer than the original. At the time, I had 3 keys on one ring, the ignition key, a rotor lock key and the key to my garage. Since my ignition is mounted on the side, Penn Jersey told me that I should keep the ignition key separate from other keys or fobs as they tend to drag. Sometimes it's the most obvious things we miss. If your key seems loose in the ignition, that could be all it is.

Chris, I think you could be right, I did have a few keys on the ring with a big dog leather key ring so it was a little heaver than just one key, also the key does seem very loose in the switch, I was talking to N8KAM and he said if you start the bike and turn the key slowly towards the off position that it should not shut off until the halfway point, well mine was shutting of right away, no where near the halfway point, so it very well could be that the key switch is bad, probabally where I should start, thanks.

 

[bdmridgeback]

If you are loosing power to multiple components like the ignition and all lights or tach, then it is one of the internal breakers within the EHC tripping.

After you come to a stop and turn the bike off, they will usually reset, and the bike will start back up until the next time.

It could be something as simple as a wire that has worn through somewhere within the backbone or rear fender and grounding out and tripping the internal breaker, a poor plug connection just causing power loss, or the EHC starting to go south altogether and the breaker is just tripping for no appearent reason.

Usually the first thing that shows signs of EHC failure is the headlight low beam or tach loosing power along with the bike shutting down at the same time.

If it was a fuel loss failure, it will stutter slightly just before shut down as it runs out of gas, same as a tank non venting issue
with the gas cap.

A power failure will be the same as reaching down and turning off the key while riding, and it dies instantly without stutter.

 

[cdogg556]

Figured it out!

Well everyone I finally think I found the reason for the bike sutting down, yesterday I decided to remove my tank and run the new hot wire from the battery, up the backbone, to a switch under my coil, and back to my ignition, well when the tank was off I found one of my connectors had a broken clip that holds it together, it was slightly pulled apart, so when the bike was running the vibration would cause the connection to come apart slightly and shut down power, I put everything back together and took her out for a 60mi ride and no problems at all! There were also a lot of wires under there that were rubbing agaist the tank and were ready to short out, I installed shrink tubing and re-routed them so they were a little closer to the backbone of the frame. Anyway, I am just glad it's not the EHC, "Yet".:2thumbs:

 

[stlmikie]

Good job cdogg! Damn good job. Feels good huh.

 

[cdogg556]

Hell yea Mike! feels real good!:up:

 

[bdm1]

Wow that's great a little effort goes a long way. Sounds like when my bike would not start and just click away when it wanted to. Sure enough it was a ground wire lose as a french whore on my starter. Boom I tighten it and had not had an issues since.

 

[cdogg556]

Last night I was riding and all of a sudden my lights went off and then came back on, this kept happening all the way home, luckily I was not to far from home because it started cutting out also, I am thinking, shit! what now! well come to find out that another connector under the tank was loose, I must have missed it when I fixed the other one, so I spent most of the day putting shrink tubing over "ALL" the connectors under the tank, zipped tied the crap out of everything and so far so good, there are so many wires under the tank on these bikes, there really is not enough room for all of them under there, I think it is just something that we need to check every now and again to make sure everything is O.K.