starter control switch

[BubbleHead]

has anyone experienced a sluggish or delayed reaction when starting their bike? Especially when it's cold or the first start of the day. Mine for lack of a better term, staggers or delays for a second when I first push the start button. Not everytime, but occasionaly. It almost seems like the compression releases don't want to work instantly like I think they should. After it warms up that issue seems to go away. I saw a thread somewhere here that I think addressed the rear starter plate contact. Something about it getting dirty and making bad contact. Only wouldn't that happen all the time instead of just when it's cold?

 

[Loafington]

has anyone experienced a sluggish or delayed reaction when starting their bike? Especially when it's cold or the first start of the day. Mine for lack of a better term, staggers or delays for a second when I first push the start button. Not everytime, but occasionaly. It almost seems like the compression releases don't want to work instantly like I think they should. After it warms up that issue seems to go away. I saw a thread somewhere here that I think addressed the rear starter plate contact. Something about it getting dirty and making bad contact. Only wouldn't that happen all the time instead of just when it's cold?

Mine does the same thing. I am going to guess on this one but I believe that the EHC goes through some sort of self test before the start button becomes active. It appears that once the speedo needle returns to zero, the engine will start. If you turn the key to on, press the run button and then press the start button too quick in sequence, it will not start until the speedometer needle returns to zero. I may be wrong, but in my past experiences with electronic controllers and whatnot, this is a common thing.

 

[jon57]

Dealer told me that was normal. About 2secs.

 

[Raywood]

I have learned over the last almost 6 years of owning BD's that you have to have a fully charged battery to start these big motors. All of us should have our bikes on "Life Support" when in the garage.
Also, you should always let the bikes electronics cycle through it sequence before starting.

:flag:

 

[woodbutcher]

how old is the battery????????????????? mine is doing the same thing and i've got a new battery on order. i'll let you know if this fixes it. it ain't always the EHC. :2thumbs: :2thumbs: :2thumbs:

ray, you beat me to it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Korben Dallas]

Mine stays on life support, and I let it cycle fully before pushing the start button, and it goes..

wromp.........................(stop).............whirr,whirrr, buddin', buddin'

how's that for actual sound effects?

 

[BubbleHead]

Thanks guys. I guess I should say first that I forgot to mention that I always allow the system to cycle. I never try to start it without the speedo returning to a rest. Korben, you called it. Great sound effects guy!
My bike is only slightly over a year old. My battery has never failed me so far. Now during the fall, spring and summer ( sometimes even winter on a nice day) I ride it almost everyday ( thus the 14,000 miles in just one year).
So I'm thinking my battery is ok. During the winter or cooler months it's on life support till I fire it back up again.
Korben explained even better than me with way less words.

 

[Korben Dallas]

Glad I could help!

 

[Nomad2day]

I believe Dogvet said if you twist the throttle while cranking, the compression releases will not open or energize when it cranks. Gets a signal on the throttle being opened.

 

[Loafington]

I believe Dogvet said if you twist the throttle while cranking, the compression releases will not open or energize when it cranks. Gets a signal on the throttle being opened.

That might be true on fuel injected motors, not true on carbureted ones. Unless there is a throttle position sensor, the EHC has no way of knowing if the throttle is open or closed.

 

[Gas Man]

That might be true on fuel injected motors, not true on carbureted ones. Unless there is a throttle position sensor, the EHC has no way of knowing if the throttle is open or closed.

Agreed... no signal from a carbed bike... however I still don't touch the throttle when starting...

 

[Raywood]

Thanks guys. I guess I should say first that I forgot to mention that I always allow the system to cycle. I never try to start it without the speedo returning to a rest. Korben, you called it. Great sound effects guy!
My bike is only slightly over a year old. My battery has never failed me so far. Now during the fall, spring and summer ( sometimes even winter on a nice day) I ride it almost everyday ( thus the 14,000 miles in just one year).
So I'm thinking my battery is ok. During the winter or cooler months it's on life support till I fire it back up again.
Korben explained even better than me with way less words.

Glad you're getting a lot of miles out of her!!!! I would load test the battery though just to know how much it's putting out.
Then I would pull the solenoid cover and clean the contacts like BBChopper did on his and I'll bet that will do it.



2 Cheers for KD's sound effects!

 

[Chopper Dave]

Thanks guys. I guess I should say first that I forgot to mention that I always allow the system to cycle. I never try to start it without the speedo returning to a rest. Korben, you called it. Great sound effects guy!
My bike is only slightly over a year old. My battery has never failed me so far. Now during the fall, spring and summer ( sometimes even winter on a nice day) I ride it almost everyday ( thus the 14,000 miles in just one year).
So I'm thinking my battery is ok. During the winter or cooler months it's on life support till I fire it back up again.
Korben explained even better than me with way less words.

BBD.....remember.....if your battery gets a weak cell......it will still show up green on the tender.....my battery was over a year old.....I never had any problems with it......but I went to a Interstate 310 CCA battery just because of the more cca's and that Ohmster suggested it when I was having my speedo freeze up sometimes when it was cold(40 degree's)
no problems now....I also have the firmware downloaded in the EHC :up:

 

[dogvet]

I believe Dogvet said if you twist the throttle while cranking, the compression releases will not open or energize when it cranks. Gets a signal on the throttle being opened.

What I said was that when you twist the throttle, your cranking compression increases enough to stall the starter. The compression releases are only activated for 1 second durting the start up to allow the engine to roll through the first compression stroke. Even then, when the engine is cold, there will still be a moment of hesitation. A drawback of big bore high compression engines and short duration cams.:2thumbs:

 

[BubbleHead]

What I said was that when you twist the throttle, your cranking compression increases enough to stall the starter. The compression releases are only activated for 1 second durting the start up to allow the engine to roll through the first compression stroke. Even then, when the engine is cold, there will still be a moment of hesitation. A drawback of big bore high compression engines and short duration cams.:2thumbs:

DV, thanks. I think that is the most appliqable diagnosis of my question. Because after that momentary hesistation it starts right up and cranks strong. It only happens on the first start of the day mostly. After it's been warmed up any at all it's fine, except when I stupidly touch the throttle even a tiny bit first before cranking it, then BANG, it will fire off like a rifle shot. Boy has that thrown some people to the ground at a gas station :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: I just smile and roll away :up:

 

[BubbleHead]

Glad you're getting a lot of miles out of her!!!! I would load test the battery though just to know how much it's putting out.
Then I would pull the solenoid cover and clean the contacts like BBChopper did on his and I'll bet that will do it.



2 Cheers for KD's sound effects!

Thanks Ray!! Coming from the Mileage Master himself, that's a compliment!!!
I'll never catch up to you but I bought it to ride it. It costs way too much to let it sit in a garage and stare at it. For all that money I want to enjoy it to the max every second I can.:2thumbs: I will pull that starter solonoid cover and check that contact plate though. That could be adding to the issue. Thanks

 

[Nomad2day]

What I said was that when you twist the throttle, your cranking compression increases enough to stall the starter. The compression releases are only activated for 1 second durting the start up to allow the engine to roll through the first compression stroke. Even then, when the engine is cold, there will still be a moment of hesitation. A drawback of big bore high compression engines and short duration cams.

Thanks for the clarification Dogvet...
Been a while from when I read it but I refrain from twisting the throttle at all when I crank it after I read your original post....:2thumbs:

 

[reloaderbmg]

mine does the same thing now and then , just nothing for 1 sec. then roll over, ill watch the speedo new time!! thanks guys!!

 

[Nomad2day]

Dogvet,
I went back and read what I thought you had said but I was mistaken. Can you tell me if the below quote is accurate about the compression releases not engaging?

In reality it was Kirk927 that posted these words on a problem...

Also, make sure you have the throttle closed as the comp releases will not engage and this is the loud bang you are hearing. My K-9 does this on occasion and this is what Jason and Brad (BDM techs) told me is the issue. IF it continues to be a problem, I'm going to have it gone over at my local BDM shop. I hope it hasn't sheared any teeth off of the starter ring gear on the clutch pack.

It was in a post on a loud bang in the starter area when trying to crank a bike.

http://www.bigdogbiker.com/forums/drive-train/5163-very-loud-bang-starter-clutch-area.html

Sorry for the confusion but it seems to fit in as well. Don't twist the throttle while cranking.
.

 

[Loafington]

I don't see how the compresion releases know if the throttle is open or closed while starting the engine. I know that if you open the throttle while starting the engine, more air/fuel mixture gets sucked in and starter kick back occurs, and sometimes engine flooding which will cause all sorts of problems if one continues to do so. The compression releses are electronic. Me not being an S&S technician, the only way I can think of the compression releases closing when they are not supposed to while the throttle is opened is that the increased compression during the start cycle causes them to close before the engine fires up. That is if the compression releases work in that manner. If they close electronically, then I do not see how they would not engage if the throttle was open during engine start. I don't know.