Suspension Rebuild

[Brent Herridge]

Parts are here from WSW. Fournales shocks and fork rebuild kit. Curtis had 2 chrome fender brackets too.

I'll keep y'all posted on progress. I start Saturday AM.

 

[roadie1389]

Do me a fav and measure the springs for me.

 

[Jersey Big Mike]

do you have one of these? https://www.zoro.com/proto-38-drive...qyMZzVyhkUW7rjdu8G8_jZC3ps5rQlk8aAmmkEALw_wcB

If not, you going to have a hard time verifing the torque when you install the new shocks.
Also -- I HIGHLY recommend doing ONE rear shock at a time.

 

[Brent Herridge]

15 5/8" length of the progressive springs. My spacer is 14". Oil has 20 written on it, so I presume its 20W. Factory is 30W isn't it ?

Curtis said factory spacer is 11 1/4, which he normally increases to 12" with the progressive springs. Thanks to the other Eric, I realized I have 14" over tubes, so Curtis made bigger spacers. I bet the former owner changed the springs and spacers when the new front end was put on. They don't have many miles, but they're 13 years old so I'll probably go ahead and change them anyway.

Mike - I got a cheap set of those socket adapters. 3/4 is the biggest, so hopefully it doesn't shear off and round the nut first time I use it. I also distinctly remember the one-at-a-time advice.

Also - if you get the pump, I highly recommend checking your factory air pressure. Docs say don't check it, but Curtis advised to verify it, and mine were substantially lower than what factory pressure was supposed to be. I also verified how much pressure is lost when disconnecting (on Curtis' good advice), and it was pretty substantial - 20 - 25 PSI on the main body, and 50 - 75 on the lower pressure ride height adjustment. And that high pressure side (365 PSI factory default) only pumps up 2 PSI per pump.

It's going to take quite a commitment to make adjustments with that thing underneath the bike.......can't say I really plan to do a lot of that.

 

[woodbutcher]

make sure you put painter's tape on the top tree around the bolt so you don't scratch the surface with the socket.

the first time i changed oil in my forks, it was changed from the factory 30wt to 20wt and i didn't care for it very much. felt a little spongy and not as responsive. you might like it, but then again, you might want to grab a qt. of 30wt and measure out 10oz for each tube.

 

[Jersey Big Mike]

Also - if you get the pump, I highly recommend checking your factory air pressure. Docs say don't check it, but Curtis advised to verify it, and mine were substantially lower than what factory pressure was supposed to be. I also verified how much pressure is lost when disconnecting (on Curtis' good advice), and it was pretty substantial - 20 - 25 PSI on the main body, and 50 - 75 on the lower pressure ride height adjustment. And that high pressure side (365 PSI factory default) only pumps up 2 PSI per pump.

It's going to take quite a commitment to make adjustments with that thing underneath the bike.......can't say I really plan to do a lot of that.

I did not have the experience you did - my pressure was close to factory specs when I got them
The pump easily put in more pressure per stroke than 2psi -- Bear in mind this is a LVHP setup, it is imperative when pumping up the shocks that you use the FULL stroke of the pump, all the way till it bottoms out, I suspect you're stopping just short of that (like you tend to on a bicycle pump where it doesn't matter).

 

[Jersey Big Mike]

As for the wrench.
I first tried a normal crows foot but quickly realized it was difficult to keep on the bolt and truly limited the options for positions grabbinig the bolt head.

When I found the torque adapter things got much easier.
The added length made attaching to the ratchet or torque wrench easier and the 12 point box end allowed much much easier positioning, especially when appling the requisite torque.

 

[Brent Herridge]

I know what you mean with the pump. It is the last but that adds the PSI.

 

[Brent Herridge]

Well...........I did not make the progress I intended. I felt bad and just lazed around yesterday. I thought I could get away with a pipe that would fit over a regular box-end wrench, but Home Depot doesn't sell anything big enough to go over it. So I ordered the part Jersey Big Mike shows above so I can fit a socket on it and use the pipe I have for that.

Today I changed fluids and fixed a hole in my garage ceiling. I also installed the new rear master cylinder screw Curtis supplied since I discovered one was just missing. Today I discovered the rear derby cover was also missing a screw, so I'll try to find that tomorrow. I've seen posts that say those are just cosmetic - so is there no risk of leakage there ? Another bolt was stripped and not holding anything when I checked them all for tightness.

I also noticed 3 other things. First, this plate on the front end of the shocks covering the front bolts:



Nobody else mentioned it, but i presume I can simply remove it with that visible bolt and the other one next to it.

Second, a 3/4 box wrench was very sloppy on the rear bolts. I figure about one inch of slop at the end of a wrench. I tried 11/16 and 18mm and neither was big enough.

Jersey Big Mike (and anyone else) - was yours this loose ?

Finally, there is some type of fitting between the existing shock mount and the bolt that is loose. It moves and must allow the shock to "ride" in the mount. The Fournales docs - and Curtis - said the rubber O-rings are crucial and must allow the unit free movement, but there's no way a little rubber O-ring will allow the kind of movement this metal fitting would allow.

Anybody have this on their original setup ? Mine is also Air ride currently, and I think its factory.

 

[roadie1389]

That plate is there in-case the front bolt breaks and the shock does not hit the ground while riding. Yes you just take it off but make sure to put it back.

 

[Brent Herridge]

I thought I had all the pre-req equipment, so I started on the shocks, ready to finish and road test.

First, the lift was in the way of the shocks themselves, so I got another scissor lift for the rear. The problem, is the hydro lift moves as it lifts. I had to raise it higher to get a long enough socket and pipe to break the bolts loose. I realized it was moving and had to use a 3rd jack to lift the rear and reposition the rear lift. I still ended up with it only half suspended.




I heated with a (new) heat gun for 3 minutes, and both ends broke loose without too much drama once I got enough clearance for the cheater to do its work. The frame receivers where these bolts attach was boogered up, but I cleaned them the best I could. The bolts are tight all the way out. They don't get loose like normal bolts.


That's when I ran into the Show Stopper.

The new Fournales shocks are nearly 1/8" shorter than the originals. I expected the forward mount to stick into the frame longitudinally, so you could let the threads tighten it to the length needed. But since both ends have bolts that go in from the sides, it has to be perfect in length. These pics show the shocks with the same bolt position front and rear. I know the tape measure is a crude instrument, but you can still see it's nearly 1/8" difference.




I tried bolting it up with each end first, but both ways the other end was too crooked to get started. I also tried increasing air pressure in that end of the shock, but that had no effect on it either. Softails move by lengthening the shock, so the rear wheel off the ground should position the swingarm in its shortest position for the shocks.

I called Curtis, but I just saw that he's taking vacation all week, so I guess I won't be hearing from him.

Any ideas ?

-- Stuck

 

[Jwooky]

Can’t you just drop the rear/swing arm a little?

1/8 is probably within variation shock to shock.

 

[Brent Herridge]

The day is saved - removed the other shock and its aligned now.........whew

I hope the next post is a raving review of the Fournales.

 

[Th3InfamousI]

The day is saved - removed the other shock and its aligned now.........whew

I hope the next post is a raving review of the Fournales.

Glad you figured it out, yea you need to remove both so the swing arm can fully collapse.

 

[Mr. Wright]

You can call me if you can't get ahold of the Kaptin. You made that job a lot harder than it needed to be. And there was only 1/16" difference in the shocks.

 

[Brent Herridge]

Big Jersey Mike suggested it yesterday. And yeah, it's really all I could do. So that went together pretty well today.




I did not see any blockage, but I still put both bushings on the outside of Left shock. It just made it a little easier to install and to get LocTite on. Ground clearance is good too:



Then I finally got to try it out.

The factory air ride really only has 1 shock. There is a "normal" shock, but only 1 air shock. And since the fender goes all the way down to the tire when deflated, you can tell the "normal" shock does nothing. So I was expecting quite an improvement.

Unfortunately, I can't say it's that different. It's a little better, and it apparently takes some mileage to fully set and adjust. I logged nearly 150 miles today (perfect weather - Park Road 4 near Marble Falls if you want to live vicariously thru Google Maps ) so it should be pretty close.

The best part is it should always just work. The air ride has bothered me since I got the bike. To be cool, you need an air tank so you can instantly raise and lower the bike. BD doesn't do it that way. You have to wait on this little air compressor to fill it up. So it ends up just annoying..........and unreliable.

I definitely need a longer kickstand though. Even when I have two 1x4s under it, its still a little more lean than before when it was totally deflated. I guess they installed Ridgeback kickstands on K9s when they had air-ride ?



I'm really just so happy to finally be back on the road now that we're in the best weather of the year. I'll do the forks when its cold.

Jersey Mike - thanks for all your help.

Curtis WSW - thanks for all the help and support you provided too.

 

[Brent Herridge]

Shannon - I'm sure it would've been a 1 hour event for someone experienced. That's the problem for shade-tree mechanics. It's always the first time.

My advice to anyone else doing this - get a 3/4" ratchet box wrench, and cut the other end off so you can get a pipe over it. That would make this a really easy job. My jacks/lifts were also quite the drama, but ended up being OK. if you had that sorted properly from the beginning, it would also make this job so much easier.

 

[Jersey Big Mike]

What pressures did you end up using?
Your fender looks significantly higher than mine. I'll see if I can get a picture tomorrow.

Your welcome my friend -- anytime.

 

[Brent Herridge]

I went stock pressure, per the docs. 175 on rear and I think 365 up front. I had to adjust to get it back up to spec.

I lost 50 PSI on detach on the back and 25 up front. So pump up +50 on rear and +25 in front to get it right.

 

[KaptinAmerika]

If the ride still feels stiff drop the pressure.