Zero oil pressure - But what is this?

Energy One
ChopperJeff

ChopperJeff

Active Member
The cause of my oil pressure going to zero was due to a broken piece of metal from the engine working its way into the oil pump, causing the shear pin to break, and shutting the pump down.

Now my mechanic just needs to find where this piece of metal came from. I've attached a couple of pictures of it.

Judging from the slightly curved shape of it, it would appear to have come from a sleeve of some sort. Does this piece happen to look familiar to anybody?

The mechanic is going to proceed to tearing down the engine until he finds where this thing came from. If he doesn't find it after pulling the heads, he's going to yank the crank shaft and look around there.

We both feel it's very important to locate where this thing broke off from as I obviously don't want any more pieces breaking loose, plus whatever this piece came from is most likely not working too well. :confused:

Once this mystery is solved, I'm thinking of replacing the cam with something that will provide better performance. Sine the engine is already down, the cost of this upgrade will only be the cost of the cam. Is this a worthwhile upgrade?

Ride safe.
 

Attachments

N8KAM

N8KAM

Well-Known Member
Looks like either part of an alignment dowel. or perhaps part of a roller bearing cage... Keep us informed as to what you find..
 
V

V

Guru
If the crank pin, rods and plates together like they are soppose to be how would tha size pc get out of the assembly? Just curious! It does have a large radius appearance like the crank pin:confused:
 
ChopperJeff

ChopperJeff

Active Member
My mechanic just called and said that the valve guide seal is broken, and thus is pretty sure that's where this hunk of metal came from. Certainly explains my previous oil burning issue too.

His machinist friend is going to check out the cylinders and see if they need to be honed.

I'll know more on Thursday as to the total health of the engine.

At this point I'm thinking I may as well upgrade the cam. Do you guys agree? Is it a 600 that most people install? If I go with that cam, where should I purchase it from?

Thanks guys for your input!
 
kfoss8

kfoss8

Active Member
Calendar Participant
the 600 S&S cam is what i run in mine i like it and it was a noticable difference bought mine from ebay
 
V

V

Guru
600 S&S is a good cam and there is one on flea bay now. There also may be someone on here that has one. I went with a Woods .590 has good low end torque and mid range. just about zero decel pop!

V
 
T

twowheel99

Active Member
ChopperJeff said:
My mechanic just called and said that the valve guide seal is broken, and thus is pretty sure that's where this hunk of metal came from. Certainly explains my previous oil burning issue too.

His machinist friend is going to check out the cylinders and see if they need to be honed.

I'll know more on Thursday as to the total health of the engine.

At this point I'm thinking I may as well upgrade the cam. Do you guys agree? Is it a 600 that most people install? If I go with that cam, where should I purchase it from?

Thanks guys for your input!
Click to expand...
The problem with that statement is a valve guide seal is not made of metal, he could have meant it could be part of a valve spring keeper(retainer) or part of the guide itself but in most cases a valve guide seal is either a rubber umbrella or a hard teflon plastic seal with a small insert acting as a seal. But lets hope its either a keeper or part of the valve guide and you don't have to open up the lower end.....
Good Luck
2
 
V

V

Guru
If it is part of the actual valve guide and it broke and fell in to the cylinder it should have had no way to have gotten to the pump.

And the reverse of this is if it broke off in the top end wouldn't it have had to travel thru a oil return to get into the pump?

Just askin:confused:
 
BadBrad

BadBrad

2005 Pitbull
V said:
If it is part of the actual valve guide and it broke and fell in to the cylinder it should have had no way to have gotten to the pump.

And the reverse of this is if it broke off in the top end wouldn't it have had to travel thru a oil return to get into the pump?

Just askin:confused:
Click to expand...
That's what I'm thinkin' V. How does a piece of metal that large get from the top of piston back down into the oil tank to be pumped again? :confused::confused: I have to admit, when I saw that piece, the valve guide was the first thing that came into my mind, but only by shape, certainly not by location. The TP rocker boxes are said to have geometry issues and do not hit the valve square, causing oblong wearing on the valve guide. I had a valve break mid stem about 2 months ago and raised hell when it fell into the cylinder.
 
ChopperJeff

ChopperJeff

Active Member
As for how long did I have no oil pressure, I'd say for about 3 miles. The oil idiot light came on when heading home from work when I was about that far from home.

I'll post more of the details once the engine is looked at by the machinist which should be by the end of this week. I appreciate everyones input. Am now looking into cams. Might as well take advantage of the fact that my engine is all torn apart.
 
V

Vegas

Well-Known Member
I agree though, no oil pressure for at least 3-5 minutes means a complete tear down and rebuild.
 
Raywood

Raywood

The Pirate
Staff member
Calendar Participant
Troop Supporter
ChopperJeff, looks like we are in the same boat and with about the same mileage on our motors. I have mine apart right now also.

As for the cam, I would say that until you open up the heads (remember the 05's came with smaller valves) then a cam is not going to give you much or at least thats the way I see it.

I'm too looking for a .600 cam while I have mine apart so will keep my eyes on ebay.

:cheers::cheers:
 
ChopperJeff

ChopperJeff

Active Member
Raywood - Yes, it would seem you may be having similar issues, huh? Except I don't recall you stating that you had lost oil pressure... just heard something give way and started making noise. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

As for the crankshaft inspecting and such, my mechanic is trying to avoid doing that in order to save me some money. He also feels that if this broken piece came from the valve area, then there's no need to go into it any farther. However, like you guys said, it may be cheap insurance at this point. I think I'll pick the mechanic's brain some more and see what he thinks. I do appreciate the fact that he's looking after me financially, and trying not to do any unneeded repairs/inspections. He did say that there was a lot of "stuff" at the bottom of the crankcase that appeared to be some sort of lube used when the engine was built. Not that that would really cause my problem though.

While he's in there I'm going to have him replace the tappets, especially since the S&S manual says to replace them every 25,000 miles. Mine looked fine, but he said that they may have lasted longer than usual due to the rollers at the top of the rocker arms (At least I think that's what he said, or something like that. This stuff is still a bit of a mystery to me).
 
ChopperJeff

ChopperJeff

Active Member
Raywood - Yes, it would seem you may be having similar issues, huh? Except I don't recall you stating that you had lost oil pressure... just heard something give way and started making noise. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

As for the crankshaft inspecting and such, my mechanic is trying to avoid doing that in order to save me some money. He also feels that if this broken piece came from the valve area, then there's no need to go into it any farther. However, like you guys said, it may be cheap insurance at this point. I think I'll pick the mechanic's brain some more and see what he thinks. I do appreciate the fact that he's looking after me financially, and trying not to do any unneeded repairs/inspections. He did say that there was a lot of "stuff" at the bottom of the crankcase that appeared to be some sort of lube used when the engine was built. Not that that would really cause my problem though.

While he's in there I'm going to have him replace the tappets, especially since the S&S manual says to replace them every 25,000 miles. Mine looked fine, but he said that they may have lasted longer than usual due to the rollers at the top of the rocker arms (At least I think that's what he said, or something like that. This stuff is still a bit of a mystery to me).
 
V

Vegas

Well-Known Member
Doing the job twice never saves anybody money. If that happened to me the crank would be shot, but you may have better luck.
 
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