Clutch Problems

[slowrower]

Well, after hours of adjusting the clutch it was time to go deeper. Problem was getting it into neutral with the motor running, bike would creep no matter how tight the clutch cable was and way too much grip pressure.

First I pulled off the belt cover to check the clutch actuator in case the problem was here. Nope ... all worked fine, nothing worn so clean up and on to the next. Also checked the clutch rod no problem here.

Now off comes the primary (dam just changed to oil a week ago!)

Just for reference you do NOT need to remove the primary chain and clutch basket and front sprocket to replace a clutch pak, I wanted to inspect the clutch basket and look for signs of trouble which required removing the front pulley (1 5/16") and clutch (1 1/4"). There is also a seal behind the clutch basket you will want to check and replace if needed.

Clutch basket looks good, however there is a slight scratch in the inner cover (next picture)

Hmm .. lets zoom in on the clutch basket to see where it might have come from

Looks good ..

Notice how the bolt is marred a bit .. time to check the torque and see if the basket is slightly warped. I will use a dial indicator for this.

Clutch plates were worn down almost to the metal backing. We lucked out SuperFly .. everything looks fine! Just need a few parts: BDM clutch pak, outer primary cover 0-ring, new clutch snap ring (the one that came off is fine but BD recommends a new one) and its back on the road.

Next installing the new clutch plates, servicing the clutch actuator, adjust the primary chain to spec (it was very lose) install a new clutch cable (damage when the VR caught on fire!), adjust the clutch, re-install the exhaust and then go over every nut and bolt to make sure they are torqued to spec.

Replacing your clutch is very easy provided you have access to a 1/2" Air or Electric Impact Wrench, 1 1/4", 1 5/16" Impact Sockets, Hex Bits, Torque Wrench and patience.

Shots of the parts that make up the clutch in your Big Dog

Clutch cover with throw-out assembly (separates the clutch plates)

Side view - you measure the height to verify its within spec, if not clutch will be hard to engage

Seems you can replace the spring with one that is software to ease the pull or a stiffer one to grab hard

This is a standard clutch pak made up of solid metal plates and clutch discs

The inside of your clutch basket where the plates go (this would be facing you)

This is your clutch plate which is what the clutch disc grabs when you let the clutch out

Finally this is the clutch disc and this one is worn out and slipping badly. You have 12 plates and 12 discs.

 

[narow37]

Hey Slowrower, I thought your bike was red, have I missed you doing a full repaint. WTF?

 

[slowrower]

Hey Slowrower, I thought your bike was red, have I missed you doing a full repaint. WTF?

This is Superfly's Bike ... Mine is red and has had zero problems. Clutch pak needs to be replaced (nelson stay tuned). Synthetic oil in the primary burnt out the clutch pak, it was slipping with no signs other than getting harder and harder to shift. When the correct oil went in no more slipping which is why we couldn't get it in gear!! Pretty easy job, just needed the right tools.

 

[Fibersnake]

Slowrower,

Sounds like you got your hands full. On the syth for the primary, good point and it may or may not have caused accelerated wear due to slippage. One item I noted in my O & M was the only part mentioned on the use of syth was for the tranny. I know others have mentioned that some have told them on engine and many are using sythn all the way around.

Never made sense to me why BD mention not recommended for Tranny but say nothing about primary which is the normal spot to be concerned with due to the clutches slipping.

Since you had it creeping and very hard to engage, I would be surprised if it just worn plates for normally you still have no issues getting it in neutral and gear,, just does not lock up real well when in gear. That said possibly that if it slipped enough, that the plates got warped and that is causing the problems.

Be interesting to see what you find.

When you get her fixed and back together, would recommend the good ole Rev Tech Primary fluid for clutches and routine change out at every oil and filter change. At the time it is also a good time to pull the primary cover, clean out the junk, adjust the primary chain and then put new o-ring back on, toruqe to specs and go ride.

Good luck.

 

[slowrower]

Slowrower,

Sounds like you got your hands full. On the syth for the primary, good point and it may or may not have caused accelerated wear due to slippage. One item I noted in my O & M was the only part mentioned on the use of syth was for the tranny. I know others have mentioned that some have told them on engine and many are using sythn all the way around.

Never made sense to me why BD mention not recommended for Tranny but say nothing about primary which is the normal spot to be concerned with due to the clutches slipping.

Since you had it creeping and very hard to engage, I would be surprised if it just worn plates for normally you still have no issues getting it in neutral and gear,, just does not lock up real well when in gear. That said possibly that if it slipped enough, that the plates got warped and that is causing the problems.

Be interesting to see what you find.

When you get her fixed and back together, would recommend the good ole Rev Tech Primary fluid for clutches and routine change out at every oil and filter change. At the time it is also a good time to pull the primary cover, clean out the junk, adjust the primary chain and then put new o-ring back on, toruqe to specs and go ride.

Good luck.

Thanks Fiber ... good points, and I will post what I find when I pull the clutch which adjusting would not cure the hard shifting into neutral. Looking at the fluid that was just changed with hardly any miles it was a murky mess which is why I think it was slipping. Funny thing though it worked fine until we changed the primary fluid - good be coincidence but what came out was not dino stuff. I also think the same stuff was in the tranny which I changed over to Redline HD shockproof.

Thanks Again ..

 

[Dimentia]

I had the same problem. I am putting in a new clutch on my 07 K9 Sunday. I called the MFG and they told me this is a common problem with the 07. They reccomend the kevlar and stepping up to the medium spring instead of the factory. I will let you know how ist works out sunday.

 

[superfly]

Once again just another example of how great some of our members are on this forum.. Slowrower has been a fine example of taking someone under his wing and sharing his knowledge and giving his time to help me learn what I need to learn to become self suffient. THanks again slow and all others who contribute daily to make sure we get the solutions to our problems....

 

[narow37]

:2thumbs::2thumbs::2thumbs:Its always nice to help out, at least thats what I like to do. Great job guys.

 

[slowrower]

I had the same problem. I am putting in a new clutch on my 07 K9 Sunday. I called the MFG and they told me this is a common problem with the 07. They reccomend the kevlar and stepping up to the medium spring instead of the factory. I will let you know how ist works out sunday.

You getting the Kevlar plates and medium spring from BDM?? ..

 

[Dimentia]

I just put my new clutch in today. It is the Rivera primo. I went with the medium clutch spring and a new clutch pack all Kevlar. Rivera recommended using valvoline automatic transmission fluid with FA in it. Found some at the local auto parts store. So I have everything together and it runs like it's brand new!!! No slipping at all (for now). Put 150 miles on it today. Next weekend I will change the fluid again and take a look just to see how everything is holding up. I have a pic of the new spring if anyone is interested in seeing it.

 

[Fibersnake]

You know I was just replying to another thread of which I caught where DogVet had said that Big Dog went from 12 plate/disc to 9 plate/dics when they changed the ramp design to make it easier to engage.

It is interesting to see that so many of the later model are having problems with possible slippage. Kind of wonder how much this change may have an effect if any. Just something tells me, if everything else remains the same, loosing 25% of the clutch surfaces could lead to a higher chance of slippage.

They may have made some other adjustment to compensate, but still find it interesting.

 

[Dimentia]

I had twelve plates in mine. In fact when I ordered mine straight from Rivera they sent me nine. I had to call them and remind them that there are 12 in the 07's.

 

[Fibersnake]

Dimentia,

Interesting here is what DogVet wrote over in another thread.

"Quote:
Originally Posted by Loafington
How does it work exactly?

DogVet

"The angle on the ball ramps of the clutch release mecanism was changed. Along with that the number of clutch plates was changed fro 12 steel and 12 fiber to 9 and 9. This doesn't require as much separation between the plates as the 12 plate set up to disengage the clutch"

Here is the link to the folder:
http://www.bigdogbiker.com/forums/drive-train/4227-hydraulic-clutch.html

So I wonder when they went to 9 from the 12 or is one of those where some of the model within the same year have different configuration. Did yours have the re-designed ball ramp also for easier pull, if you know? Anyone know what the 08 have as far as clutch plate/disc configurations??

 

[Dimentia]

I don't know about the re-designed ball ramp for sure. I definetly know it was 12 plate/disc config. The only issue I am having with the medium spring is once it goes over center it wants to pop out quickly on me. I have adjusted the clutch several time to try and get it smooth out but no luck. I am calling rivera Monday to talk to their tech guys about this.

 

[scubaman15]

Was any of this covered in your warranty??? I'm having clutch problems and have from day one.

 

[Dimentia]

BDM will not cover it on a warranty. But if you call Rivera the MFG of the clutch they will tell you it is a common problem with them. They say the clutch spring is not strong enough and to upgrade to the medium spring. It only cost around $40 to get it and it is real easy to do yourself if you wanna try that.

 

[slowrower]

I wonder how many will have problems with the fewer clutch plates and if you plan on make improvements to your engine or have already this could be a potential problem.

Redline makes a great primary fluid which I bet is Dextron ATF 3 .. same color and smell. Nope I didn't taste it ... at least not without a few cubes and some jack!

 

[TCALZ06]

BDM will not cover it on a warranty. But if you call Rivera the MFG of the clutch they will tell you it is a common problem with them. They say the clutch spring is not strong enough and to upgrade to the medium spring. It only cost around $40 to get it and it is real easy to do yourself if you wanna try that.

How many miles on your K9 and how much did that new clutch cost?
Let us know what the fix is.

 

[Dimentia]

I had 8500 miles on it. It cost me $246 for new clutch.

 

[hoat]

I don't know about the re-designed ball ramp for sure. I definetly know it was 12 plate/disc config. The only issue I am having with the medium spring is once it goes over center it wants to pop out quickly on me. I have adjusted the clutch several time to try and get it smooth out but no luck. I am calling rivera Monday to talk to their tech guys about this.

So did you ever get it adjusted. What did the tech guys say?