Utrufrider
New Member
I know, 2 words that don't often go together. I have some extra cash and want to give the Dog some love. What are some things that the stock motor needs to make it run longer and maybe get some more ponys?
Adding power and longevity
- Thread starter Utrufrider
- Start date
Utrufrider
New Member
I'm definitely getting rid of the big dog rocker covers. I'll do rocker too but I'm trying to decide whether to go with rockers or a carb first. I have about $2500 that my wife doesn't know about so trying to stay in that range.
john sachs
Well-Known Member
What year is your Dog ? If you have the S&S rocker boxes, there's No reason to get rid of them unless they're shabby. If you have the TP boxes, then your heads most likely need to be redone. If so I would use the .600" S&S cam along with other mods to the heads. S&S "G" carbs can be reworked to make quite a bit more power, without costing an arm or a leg.
John
John
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Utrufrider
New Member
It's a 2005 Ridgeback and the covers are flaking pretty bad. Is there much to benefit from roller rockers vs regular?
mleach72
Well-Known Member
There are lots of reviews on the 585 here. It is pretty popular if you are looking for a power boost without spending a lot on other motor work that is recommended for the 600. Personally, I love it! Here is another testament to what the 585 will do. I have all of the screws on my mirrors as tight as I can get them. The mirrors are very hard to move. It takes two hands to adjust them. Every time I hammer the throttle, it completely flips my mirrors. In fact, I don't do it very often because it's such a pain to get them back where I like them. Every time I have to adjust them, I am amazed at how much torque the motor has to produce to move the mirrors that much!
john sachs
Well-Known Member
Depends on the cam you use. If over .600" lift I like to use them.
If you have TP rocker boxes, you need to get rid of them, before they do, or have done valve train damage. They'll will have ONLY 4 bolts on the top cover. S&S rocker boxes have 6 bolts on the top cover.
John
john sachs
Well-Known Member
Sounds like you may have a loose motor mount/s, motor alignment problem, or possible flywheel issue if you have that much vibration. While you can't circumcise a baby on a Harley engine powered vehicle, you shouldn't have the kind of vibration you describe it takes to move the mirrors.
John
mleach72
Well-Known Member
Lol. I think you misunderstand John. It's not vibration. The motor is smooth as silk. It's acceleration g-forces. Believe me, I am hanging on for dear life, and my ass is on the rear fender.
Ok, well I 'll throw my 2 cents in on this since, I've personally spent way to much on my Mastiff to only find out the hard way that I was ripped off, shitty work cause my 117 to blow and had to buy a complete new motor.
My Mastiff came with the TP rocker boxes, and I continuously kept blowing valve seats, I finally bit the bullet and ordered everything to go from a detuned EPA regulated motor (Tp rocker box motor) to what S&S originally made these motors for. If you have TP Rocker boxes on your 05-06 bigdog you more than likely have a detuned motor, no if and buts about it. Tp rockers were only used on detuned motors except in late 06 when they had spares laying around and just threw them on, but the good news is S&S has a kit you can buy that will take your motor to what they designed these motors for. Now with that out the way this kit and i don't remember every part but I know it comes with a .600 cam, pushrods, roller rockers, S&S boxes, Springs, valves, shorter jugs, something for the intake (cant remember what it was called), you can get it with heads, but to save money I order a set of heads from Derrick and Donna, 900 for both heads verses 800 a head from S&S.
I had the head work done by the guy doing the work on the bike, which i would never recommend him since I only got 500 miles out of this motor before it blew because of poor workmanship and even have the letter from S&S to prove that (since i sent my motor to them to determine the root cause of failure). But in total the kit, heads and work I only had maybe $2500 in everything. I was running 10.5 to 1 compression, dyno tuned and was pushing 125 hp and 115 torque big difference from the factory detuned 96 HP the bike came with.
If you do have a TP rocker box motor and have 2500 to spend, I would call S&S give them your motor serial number and have them send the un-detune kit for your motor to the shop of your choice. That is truly the only way to get the originally designed power from your motor and believe me its a lot more than the detuned 96 hp you get out the TP rocker box motor, and as long as you break it in the right way your bike will have the longevity your looking for and more power than you'll know what to do with. Just my thoughts over a air intake, you'll get new rocker boxes with the kit and its everything you're looking for.
But if you have S&S rocker boxes, I'd see which cam you have in the bike and go to the next size up or to the point you don't have to replace springs and have head work, put a good air intake on it and maybe a performance exhaust, and buy a set of rocker box covers and you should be good to go.
My Mastiff came with the TP rocker boxes, and I continuously kept blowing valve seats, I finally bit the bullet and ordered everything to go from a detuned EPA regulated motor (Tp rocker box motor) to what S&S originally made these motors for. If you have TP Rocker boxes on your 05-06 bigdog you more than likely have a detuned motor, no if and buts about it. Tp rockers were only used on detuned motors except in late 06 when they had spares laying around and just threw them on, but the good news is S&S has a kit you can buy that will take your motor to what they designed these motors for. Now with that out the way this kit and i don't remember every part but I know it comes with a .600 cam, pushrods, roller rockers, S&S boxes, Springs, valves, shorter jugs, something for the intake (cant remember what it was called), you can get it with heads, but to save money I order a set of heads from Derrick and Donna, 900 for both heads verses 800 a head from S&S.
I had the head work done by the guy doing the work on the bike, which i would never recommend him since I only got 500 miles out of this motor before it blew because of poor workmanship and even have the letter from S&S to prove that (since i sent my motor to them to determine the root cause of failure). But in total the kit, heads and work I only had maybe $2500 in everything. I was running 10.5 to 1 compression, dyno tuned and was pushing 125 hp and 115 torque big difference from the factory detuned 96 HP the bike came with.
If you do have a TP rocker box motor and have 2500 to spend, I would call S&S give them your motor serial number and have them send the un-detune kit for your motor to the shop of your choice. That is truly the only way to get the originally designed power from your motor and believe me its a lot more than the detuned 96 hp you get out the TP rocker box motor, and as long as you break it in the right way your bike will have the longevity your looking for and more power than you'll know what to do with. Just my thoughts over a air intake, you'll get new rocker boxes with the kit and its everything you're looking for.
But if you have S&S rocker boxes, I'd see which cam you have in the bike and go to the next size up or to the point you don't have to replace springs and have head work, put a good air intake on it and maybe a performance exhaust, and buy a set of rocker box covers and you should be good to go.
john sachs
Well-Known Member
My 2 cents.
I've been doing bike engine work for a lot of years. I've done a lot of engine work for members on this forum as well. To me, my reputation is the MOST important thing in the world.
If you have TP rocker boxes, you need to get rid of them if you are going to keep your bike, and don't want major engine expense down the road.
1- S&S rocker boxes are the proper replacement, because the rocker arm geometry is correct for the S&S heads.
2- There's NO reason to buy new S&S heads, if the major damage by the TP boxes has not gotten out of hand.(Loose guides going up and down with the valve, valve stem wearing through the guide into the aluminum guide bore or the valve head trying to seat in the aluminum beyond the seat insert). Your heads can be reconditioned to be better, and have better parts installed like ( valve springs to accommodate higher lift cams) than any manufacturers' off the shelf heads, or( DE-TUNE kit ???)
3- There's NO need to buy new S&S cylinders, when yours can be bored oversize, and shortened to make the quench area proper.
4- While you're at it, you might as well use a better cam like the .600" cam with more lift than the .585" cam, as the engine is already apart somewhat, and the .600" cam has better timing events than the .585".
5- Using the right gaskets is also important.
6- Carb work would be the icing on the cake.
All this could put you in the $2500 to $2800 range + or minus.
John
I've been doing bike engine work for a lot of years. I've done a lot of engine work for members on this forum as well. To me, my reputation is the MOST important thing in the world.
If you have TP rocker boxes, you need to get rid of them if you are going to keep your bike, and don't want major engine expense down the road.
1- S&S rocker boxes are the proper replacement, because the rocker arm geometry is correct for the S&S heads.
2- There's NO reason to buy new S&S heads, if the major damage by the TP boxes has not gotten out of hand.(Loose guides going up and down with the valve, valve stem wearing through the guide into the aluminum guide bore or the valve head trying to seat in the aluminum beyond the seat insert). Your heads can be reconditioned to be better, and have better parts installed like ( valve springs to accommodate higher lift cams) than any manufacturers' off the shelf heads, or( DE-TUNE kit ???)
3- There's NO need to buy new S&S cylinders, when yours can be bored oversize, and shortened to make the quench area proper.
4- While you're at it, you might as well use a better cam like the .600" cam with more lift than the .585" cam, as the engine is already apart somewhat, and the .600" cam has better timing events than the .585".
5- Using the right gaskets is also important.
6- Carb work would be the icing on the cake.
All this could put you in the $2500 to $2800 range + or minus.
John
Utrufrider
New Member
Hey, guys. Sorry it's been a minute since I've been on. Thank you all for the help. John and Mastiff, you both answered every question I had. I plan on taking it to Dirty Rat in SLC Utah to do the work now that it's fricken freezing.