Freak Engine Problem: Dies, but will later restart

[chacha]

OK, I'm scraching my head on this one. Any thoughts on where to go next are appreciated....

PROBLEM:
- While running, engine dies, Tach lights go out.\
- Engine will turn over fine immediately after but sounds like there's no spark.
- Waiting a couple minutes (the length of a smoke) and she starts right up and runs fine

CONDITIONS:
- Just about everything. Happens within 1 to 5 miles of firing it up. Has died at idle, under acceleration, at 40 MPH and 75 MPH
- Mostly from a cold start with the engine cold but has happened several times in a row (three) with a warm engine.
- Still have annunciator lights, turn signals and headlamp
- same conditions as hitting the "OFF" switch

WHAT I'VE DONE:

- Battery connections - Tight
- Starter connections - Tight
- put dielectric grease on EHC, Spark Plug tops
- Opened the right side controls and cleaned and dielectric greased the connections to the right hand control switch assembley.
- Inspected the right had switch assembly - found no shorts in the wires or the circuit board (Visual)
- Changed circuit breaker (it had another problem anyway)

Problem still going on. :angry:

I'm thinking the cam sensor or the coil.

What say you?

Thanks!

 

[kickstart]

Does your scoot have one of the Voltage regulators that has a problem??

Warped buss bar Recall # 07V356000

 

[Gas Man]

Does your scoot have one of the Voltage regulators that has a problem??

Warped buss bar Recall # 07V356000

VR Recall Info Thread

I would agree... sounds electrical... but I'll have to defer to some of the other guys.

 

[Raywood]

PROBLEM:
- While running, engine dies, Tach lights go out.\
- Engine will turn over fine immediately after but sounds like there's no spark.
- Waiting a couple minutes (the length of a smoke) and she starts right up and runs fine

CONDITIONS:
- Just about everything. Happens within 1 to 5 miles of firing it up. Has died at idle, under acceleration, at 40 MPH and 75 MPH

cacha, sounds like a grounded wire to me. If it's happening at different conditions and speeds then I would search for a wire that is rubbing against the frame and the insulation is rubbed off and grounding the system.
I've had an oil light problem that resulted on a grounded wire (orange wire under tank) and just lately flashing blinkers that was the result of a grounded wire under the seat.
I would go over your wiring loom very carefully checking for any worn wires.
What is the EHC telling you? Are there any lights energized that shouldn't be on when it's idling?
I wouldn't worry about the VR. In my experience once it's dead then you have severe battery problems and that doesn't seem to be the case here.

I'm betting on a wire,
Ray

 

[chacha]

Well, appears I'm back running. I pulled the coil out, checked all the connections and greased (di-electric) the plug wires. One line was a bit loose. Checked all the cam to ignitron to coil lines and greased them. Then pulled the cam and cleaned it up. Put a zip tie around the connector to the EHC to keep it tight.

Ran the bike and jiggled and pulled everything I could, but no problems. Rode three times today for an hour each without problems.

More riding tomorrow, we'll see if the Gremlin is gone...

Thanks for everyone's help on this.

 

[Chopper Dave]

Man...hope you got it fixed......

 

[Gas Man]

I feel for ya Chacha... I hate when you don't have confidence in your bike. Life just sucks!!

 

[Alicat]

Glad it works for you now, I know how much you like riding her!

With all the vibration these beasts have I'm surprised we don't hear more about electrical gremlins.

Good Ridin'
Al

 

[cskaplan]

Computer going out?

OK, I'm scraching my head on this one. Any thoughts on where to go next are appreciated....

PROBLEM:
- While running, engine dies, Tach lights go out.\
- Engine will turn over fine immediately after but sounds like there's no spark.
- Waiting a couple minutes (the length of a smoke) and she starts right up and runs fine

CONDITIONS:
- Just about everything. Happens within 1 to 5 miles of firing it up. Has died at idle, under acceleration, at 40 MPH and 75 MPH
- Mostly from a cold start with the engine cold but has happened several times in a row (three) with a warm engine.
- Still have annunciator lights, turn signals and headlamp
- same conditions as hitting the "OFF" switch

WHAT I'VE DONE:

- Battery connections - Tight
- Starter connections - Tight
- put dielectric grease on EHC, Spark Plug tops
- Opened the right side controls and cleaned and dielectric greased the connections to the right hand control switch assembley.
- Inspected the right had switch assembly - found no shorts in the wires or the circuit board (Visual)
- Changed circuit breaker (it had another problem anyway)

Problem still going on. :angry:

I'm thinking the cam sensor or the coil.

What say you?


Thanks!

I have had a similar problem, except my entire system goes dead, engine, lights, speedo. Turns out it is the computer. Apparently there is a recall on some bikes for this problem, but BD doesn't want to pay for one for my 04 Chopper.

 

[cskaplan]

I have had a similar problem with my 04 chopper, except everything electrical goes dead. Turns out to be the computer. Apparently BD has a problem and a recall for this, but not for my chopper.

 

[Gas Man]

I'm guessing you don't get that there is no computer... just a EHC... which to many is just as confusing... Have you called BDM directly or is your info coming from some dealer?

 

[cskaplan]

I am getting my info from my dealer, Thunder Cycle in Ft. Lauderdale. I would talk to BD if I knew who to call, I am hearing that the module is now back-ordered. This is after my bike has been to the shop 3 times with the prlblem and they kept telling me there was nothing wrong.

 

[GDOG_PITBULL]

Check your fuel filter! See if the problem occurs after you fill your tank. If it does not, there is a very good chance that it is fuel related and your filter may be clogged.
G

 

[bradman]

I HAVE AN 04 BULLDOG ALSO. MY CAM SENSOR WENT OUT BEFORE AS DID MY EHC. WHEN MY CAM SENSOR HEATED UP, IT WOULD START CUTTING OUT.

 

[Dakotabos]

I have replaced 4 EHCs and one Cam Sensor. But running great now with new EHC

 

[Ohmster]

Chacha,
Sounds like you are loosing ignition only since only your tach goes out and the engine shuts off. One thing to look at is your red LED on your ignition module right after this occurs. Pull the seat off and hit your run button. The red LED should light up for a couple of seconds and then go out till it see's a cam signal for the trigger. If you get the red LED when you press your run button then it could be internal in the ignition module. If you do not get the red LED when you press the run button it is a 12vdc output issue from the EHC.

Check that and see what you find.

 

[Raywood]

Chacha,
Sounds like you are loosing ignition only since only your tach goes out and the engine shuts off. One thing to look at is your red LED on your ignition module right after this occurs. Pull the seat off and hit your run button. The red LED should light up for a couple of seconds and then go out till it see's a cam signal for the trigger. If you get the red LED when you press your run button then it could be internal in the ignition module. If you do not get the red LED when you press the run button it is a 12vdc output issue from the EHC.

Check that and see what you find.

I'm likin this guy being here!!!!! :2thumbs: :flag:

 

[chacha]

Ohmster diagnosed;

Sounds like you are loosing ignition only since only your tach goes out and the engine shuts off. One thing to look at is your red LED on your ignition module right after this occurs. Pull the seat off and hit your run button. The red LED should light up for a couple of seconds and then go out till it see's a cam signal for the trigger. If you get the red LED when you press your run button then it could be internal in the ignition module. If you do not get the red LED when you press the run button it is a 12vdc output issue from the EHC.

Yep, that's exactly where I am. Right after the ignition failure, I'll have the single correct red LED on the EHC, but get no ignition LED. This made me think cam sensor..so I have one coming in to replace. After about 5 minutes of sitting, I'll get the ignition LED firing as it should and of course the bike fires right up.

Thoughts? I don't carry a multi-meter with me on the road to check the EHC--> ignition module voltage :roll:

 

[chacha]

Sul noticed;

looking at your new pipes, they both wrap around the nose cone. yours being an 03? the ign module is in there right? overheating then when cools runs ok?

Good eyes! She's an 04 and the Ignition module is under the seat, but the sensor plate is behind the points cover. The last time she failed, Hoat and I were coming back from Maryland. I pulled the points cover and Hoat did his "Magic Tapp" with a multi-tool...problem cleared. Now it could be that the extra heat from the pipes are affecting the sensor plate. I'm figuring it's a heat problem someplace with the electronics vice a vibration problem. When she does fail, it is nearly always within 8 miles of startup. Once she fires up again, she's pretty much fine for the rest of the run. I'll go a week without a problem, then she porks me just for fun! :down:

 

[bradman]

Same thing happened to me. It was the cam sensor. The teck center had me take a hairdryer to it to heat it up and behold, it would take a shit. replaced it and all was good. (till the EHC took a shit). Going on my 3rd one now.