Documenting the rebuild of my Pro Sport 107 - motor, exhaust, etc and some WTFs

Energy One

woodbutcher

Mr. Old Fart member #145
Staff member
hey, LA, might want to find the local witch coven and provide them with a couple live chickens so they can do you a hex bag to combat all that bad voodoo. maybe they can do a doll that looks like Paul and you can stick pins in it. :roll::roll::cheers: or maybe the motor builders. :angry::angry:
 

popsicle069

Member
Oil in crank case looks good, no sumping. Oil from tank looks good. Oil filter - however - had big chunkies of metal and a couple of metal shaving curlies all over outside of filter and inside filter housing. So something again is fucked up. The 1st oil change at 50 miles was perfect. 120 miles later this oil change shows damage.
LA_Dog, the contaminates may be from when the oil pump was machined. May just put new oil and filter in/on and put another 50 to 100 miles on and then check the filter again.

What about the oil tank. Did that get flushed and the lines, did they get flushed?

Hopefully this is a one time thing and you are good to go.

As far as the oil Blow by, You may need to install new Umbrellas in the rocker boxes that control the venting.
 
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LA_Dog

Go Fast, Go Faster
LA_Dog, the contaminates may be from when the oil pump was machined. May just put new oil and filter in/on and put another 50 to 100 miles on and then check the filter again.

What about the oil tank. Did that get flushed and the lines, did they get flushed?

Hopefully this is a one time thing and you are good to go.

As far as the oil Blow by, You may need to install new Umbrellas in the rocker boxes that control the venting.
Hey thanks brother- if nothing else I appreciate the positive approach. Could be and i hope so- all I can do right now is ride it - either it grenades and I get new motor or it stays ok.

Everything was surgically clean - complete rebuild - new oil tank - new SS HVHP oil pump. I'll check the umbrellas but they were new also.

Oil pressure is quite high- i don't know if this is normal for the HVHP pump. when it is all warmed up, riding through town a bit, the oil gauge shows 20+ at idle (970 rpm), and revving it pegs the gauge needle to 60 (gauge only goes to 60). I could not find any info on SS site what the "normal" pressures should be when hot.

there is return flowing into tank, but I don't know how much return is "enough" vs the pump output. I can tell you that at this last oil change I left the oil filter off and blew 2 qts of oil out the filter mount as a flush, and it took all but 30 seconds. this pump puts out some oil! Maybe it is putting more oil up into the rockers than can drain down. I'm not getting excessive oil in crank case so I know it is scavenging.

I'm using a KP stainless oil filter w/ magnet so it is really easy to inspect what's in the filter.

And this is all shit I can't get answered or at least some feedback by the shop - hell they still have not returned my message about the metal in oil.

Plus I just discovered my new braille battery is toast. I just spent morning testing electrical system because battery would be down to 10% in 1-2 days. Alarm draws 4.5ma, that's it. they messed up my new stator plug on the block by not pulling out far enough, the plug was not really connected for the first 2 weeks of riding the bike. it was loosely sitting on there arcing away, and I thought the battery seeming weak was simply due to not riding it enough. the plugs are all arced up. so that's what also probably killed the battery - been mostly riding around town on battery power only. fortunately the alternator is ok. battery will charge but has a limited capacity now / memory effect.
 

pknowles

RETIRED
Supporting Member
hey, LA, might want to find the local witch coven and provide them with a couple live chickens so they can do you a hex bag to combat all that bad voodoo. maybe they can do a doll that looks like Paul and you can stick pins in it. :roll::roll::cheers: or maybe the motor builders. :angry::angry:
I just felt a sharp pain:eek: I think if was just gas though:lol:
 

popsicle069

Member
Oil pressure is quite high- i don't know if this is normal for the HVHP pump. when it is all warmed up, riding through town a bit, the oil gauge shows 20+ at idle (970 rpm), and revving it pegs the gauge needle to 60 (gauge only goes to 60). I could not find any info on SS site what the "normal" pressures should be when hot.
Dam that does sound kinda high to me but I don't know. Maybe get ahold of John Sachs and see what he has to say. Could also get ahold of S&S and see what you should have for oil pressure and volume for the evo motor. You may be putting too much oil in the rocker boxes for the pushrod tubes to handle.

They may even have a way to reduce the pressure and volume.

With that Oil filter you can check every 25 miles if you really wanted. Kinda nice.
 

LA_Dog

Go Fast, Go Faster
yup maybe so- I'll see what SS has to say tomorrow.

BTW I got a txt message from shop saying "just block off the head breathers and let it vent through the case breather only" to stop the oil puking while riding. So I'm like WTF. My motor does vent at both the heads and case, but I'm sure I have a later model cam chest and it is not set up to be a case breather only. Maybe the logic is the added pressure will help force the oil down the rocker box drain holes? Anyway not gonna run out and try it...
 

FrankBDPS

Well-Known Member
yup maybe so- I'll see what SS has to say tomorrow.

BTW I got a txt message from shop saying "just block off the head breathers and let it vent through the case breather only" to stop the oil puking while riding. So I'm like WTF. My motor does vent at both the heads and case, but I'm sure I have a later model cam chest and it is not set up to be a case breather only. Maybe the logic is the added pressure will help force the oil down the rocker box drain holes? Anyway not gonna run out and try it...
That dosent sound right at all.
 

05chop

Well-Known Member
Like I said sorry to hear about your problems LA DOG Venting your line to bottom with that much oil puking while riding will end up on your rear tire so I see why you use a catch can. Oil pressure reading over 60 psi cold (possable defective gage) verifiy this again could be another on going sumping problem or lack of oil at the crank and flooding top end with oil from too much oil pressure.Oil lines are they 3/8 lines good return flow? My concern is metal shavings in the oil again! IMHO seek someone who can pin point(in your area) the problem because sounds like your builder gave up when this happens legel advice is next.
 

Th3InfamousI

Administrator
Staff member
A text message from the shop? Seriously? What is the world coming to?

I posted on your other post regarding oil presure around 30lbs at normal operating temp at 3k+ RPM

60lbs is why you got oil shooting out of the holes and flying all over the place.


Cold start up - 44 PSI
Warm engine @ 55 mph - 30-36 PSI
Warm at idle - 10 PSI
 

LA_Dog

Go Fast, Go Faster
good point about the gauge possibly being inaccurate- that's a cheap swap to eliminate as a possibility. I'm getting oil at crank otherwise I'd have fried the front piston by now. I (unfortunately) know for a fact that having the lower oil port restricted does not increase pressure to the upper port- the previous TP oil pump had a permanently restricted lower port in the pump and my pressures were normal on the gauge, no puking out top breather- but it kept frying the front piston.

BTW, the gauge only reads output oil pressure to the top end of motor. Kind of a crappy design IMO since you'll never, ever know what type of pressure (or lack of) is getting to the crank / pistons.
 

05chop

Well-Known Member
Plugged drains from Heads, Cylinders or check valve ball not closing in pump all can cause your problem good luck again!
 

LA_Dog

Go Fast, Go Faster
ok quick update- just did a test to see how pressures are. I've got it reading more normal now. I took the spring out for the pressure relief (item #17 in photo) and worked the spring back and forth a few times to "break it in". I also squashed it about 1/8" shorter. Now the pressure reads 30 cold idle, revved to 2k goes to about 45. Hot it reads 17lbs idle and 42lbs revved up to 4k. Guess this allowed the relieve valve (#36) to open a bit more easily. Gonna go take it for a spin.
 

Nukeranger

Nukeranger
Supporting Member
Just for comparison, my 2008 oil pump produces 30 psi cold, drops into the 25 psi range when warming up and finally between 5 and 7 when hot 190 degree oil at idle. I haven't watched it at higher revs when hot only because I was getting the low oil pressure light at idle in smoking hot outside temps at stop signs with the idle way low. So, I adjusted idle too specs.
 

LA_Dog

Go Fast, Go Faster
cool- thx- I always keep my idle around 900-950, but it looks like I got plenty of pump pressure to spare if I want to set it lower.

BTW.... you know it effing helps if your front motor mount is tight??? They put back on the old set of front mount bushings which are obviously old / collapsed (2001 bushings), and didn;t bother to tell me I needed a new set. I was wondering what the hell that thumping was as the motor revvs were winding back down through the 2k-1k range, or I hit a good bump. arrgghhh.
:angry::angry::rant::rant::angry::angry:
 

woodbutcher

Mr. Old Fart member #145
Staff member
recommended idle is 1k+_, too much under and you will be lugging the motor and these big inch motors don't like that. try not to go too much lower.
 

pauly

Active Member
Hi LA_Dog I,m only new here but have recently come across an interesting
information about our lubrication system.
Check this site completely from A to Z.

Harley-Davidson oil pressure facts


Cheers
Paul.



ok quick update- just did a test to see how pressures are. I've got it reading more normal now. I took the spring out for the pressure relief (item #17 in photo) and worked the spring back and forth a few times to "break it in". I also squashed it about 1/8" shorter. Now the pressure reads 30 cold idle, revved to 2k goes to about 45. Hot it reads 17lbs idle and 42lbs revved up to 4k. Guess this allowed the relieve valve (#36) to open a bit more easily. Gonna go take it for a spin.
 

Th3InfamousI

Administrator
Staff member
Hi LA_Dog I,m only new here but have recently come across an interesting
information about our lubrication system.
Check this site completely from A to Z.

Harley-Davidson oil pressure facts


Cheers
Paul.
You shouldn't need the heavy duty springs unless you live in a super hot climate. I do swap out my stock spring in the summer months in Texas when it's tripple digits to a stiffer spring to pump oil better. However I wouldn't recommend it unless outside temps rise above 100.

In this instance he already has too much pressure so realistically would need NOT as heavy of a stock spring.
 
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