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Bike died in mid ride, battery only a couple months old and on tinder overnight

Discussion in 'Technical' started by No H2O, Oct 1, 2018.

  1. No H2O

    No H2O Active Member
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    Here's the blow by blow of what happened this AM, 10/1/18:

    1. The last ride was on Friday 9/21/18, no issues.
    2. It was on the battery tinder from the afternoon of 9/21/2018 until this morning.
    3. This morning it started fine while still connected to the tinder.
    4. I took it off the tinder and rode a few miles (less than 5 miles).
    5. No power in mid ride, everything shut off, no working hazards.
    6. I pulled over onto the shoulder, put it in neutral and saw the "N" light on the gauge light up.
    7. Tried to start it but wouldn't turn over.
    8. Waited.
    9. It then started but died immediately.
    10. Subsequent attempts to start failed.
    11. Connected micro jumpbox.
    12. Wouldn't start.
    13. Waited about 5 minutes.
    14. It started and stayed on.
    15. I rode it 10 miles to the shop, no issues.

    Any ideas?
     
  2. roadie1389

    roadie1389 Active Member

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    It sounds like a loose wire some place. Check your running voltage, it not 14V then check stator output. While bike running wiggle all your connectors and cables to the battery.
     
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  3. No H2O

    No H2O Active Member
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    Talked to the shop just now, they did all the above as suggested, everything's in order. Their theory at this point is that there's a main fuse that at times isn't able to handle the load so it shuts off and then resets at a later time. In order to distribute the load, they're going to configure a two fuse system. I'm not sure I understand how this would work but usually whenever I pick up the bike and have them show me then I understand.
     
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  4. roadie1389

    roadie1389 Active Member

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    What control module do you have in it? Stock EHC, WP, RIP.....
     
  5. Sven

    Sven Well-Known Member

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    That says, 'phantom' black boxing. Say it happens again. The computer starts at 0000. So if you cycle the key a couple of times, this more dumps the capacitors or spikes it to ground so you keep emptying the capacitor as if bench bleeding the black box's hot to ground wire and empty the capacitors this way. Touching prongs of an ECU/ECM momentarily bleeds so much when watching an ohm meter. It can read another spike, then release a lead off the prong and retouch and watch the meter spike again.

    So the keyfobbing does basically the same thing. Toggle the keyfob quickly a couple of times to bleed it out... next time. See if it starts right up right after it goes dead. And I'm saying you have to match the OP's similar variables. No problem trying this if it's not in the same combination as stated from line 1 thru 15, meaning.
     
  6. Marky-Marc

    Marky-Marc Well-Known Member

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    So, anytime that happens there is going to be a short. As an example...just had the same thing happen on a bike in CA. It rode fine, all good...in the middle of the ride, bike shut off....pulled over/drifed and was swearing like a MOFO....waited...fired back up, no issues...rode awhile and everything was fine....TBH, on this particular bike, it was a bare wire in the right rear light/brake/turn signal housing which caused all this to happen on and off....but it could also be a bare wire in the headlight housing...or a short somewhere else......if you have a second, take the seat off, make sure you can SEE your EHC lights, turn the key to on, hit RUN (but don't start it) and take a picture/video of your EHC lights.....and then post it....it may help all the great minds on here help you out....
     
  7. RRRUFF

    RRRUFF Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like a problem I had several years ago. The ignition switch was bad. It would just die then eventually it would start back up. Jumped the switch problem went away. Replaced switch.
     
  8. No H2O

    No H2O Active Member
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    The only thing that the shop found wrong was the automatic fuse on the wire emanating from the main power supply (positive battery terminal) had shut off a number of times and had excessive wear so they upgraded main power supply automatic fuse/breaker from a 30amp to a 50amp. Apparently this type of fuse, when overloaded, doesn't trip/burnt out but instead it shuts off and then after a while is able to re-engage. I only rode it a few miles and it didn't happen but then again it only happened previously maybe one out of half a dozen rides if that.
     
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  9. No H2O

    No H2O Active Member
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    Rode it in to work today, everything works fine.
    Only thing I noticed, when pulling into the garage at work, I clutch in while in 1st and use my right hand to show my ID, the gauge had all the green-yellow-red lights lit up (as if it was about to stall out. But there was no dip in the RPMS and the bike stayed on and the lights returned to normal when I gave it some gas to drive down to the motorcycle parking area.
    Then when I clutched in again, in 1st, since a car ahead of me was parking, it happened again.
    Bike still on and running normally just never seen this behavior before.
     
  10. pknowles

    pknowles semi-retired...---... GURU
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    Maybe idling too low?
     
  11. roadie1389

    roadie1389 Active Member

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    Sounds like 2 things - 1) might need to adjust the clutch. It might be dragging just a bit, 2) idle is too low. The Tach ring will flash if the idle gets too low. Turn the idle up just a bit.
     
  12. Rottweiler

    Rottweiler Well-Known Member
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    Yes the tach lights will flash if idle is set to low. The shop may have adjusted it for you?
     
  13. francoblay1

    francoblay1 The Spaniard

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    :agree:
     
  14. No H2O

    No H2O Active Member
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    It happened again this morning :(

    I fired it up after not having ridden since Friday.
    Usually I fire up and take off but today I warmed it up a bit since the idle was rough due to the dropping temperatures. Once the idle was steady I threw on my gear and took off.
    Again, same <5 mile distance as always, the power cut off.
    I paid closer attention to the symptoms:
    - I couldn't get any power but the engine was still running/idling
    - The gauge showed the red oil drop (oil level is fine) but no other lights.
    - Hazards still not working
    - Then everything shut off
    - Tried to restart it as it was rolling off to the shoulder using the pop-out-the-clutch-in-2nd method, didn't work.
    - Tried to restart the bike, the motor attempted to start but couldn't similar to a symptom where the battery doesn't have sufficient power .
    - Waited maybe 2 minutes.
    - Fired it up without attaching the jump box, took off, no further issues.

    Something isn't warming up enough since it happens after a few days of not riding and within the first few miles.
    Something isn't cooled off enough since it won't restart immediately, it needs to rest a couple minutes (less time in colder weather like now, more time in warmer weather, like summer)

    I don't believe it's a short, the shop says they checked the wires from front to back and couldn't find anything. That, and it always happens according to a pattern of:
    - not ridden in a couple days
    - first thing in the AM
    - less than 5 miles

    If it were a short wouldn't it occur more randomly?

    Any other ideas?
     
  15. MossBerg590

    MossBerg590 Active Member

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    I had a problem with my bike randomly blowing the horn and shutting off whenever I used either brake, turn signals etc. Sometimes it would do it every time I used something, sometimes I could ride weeks without it happening. When it died, pull over, wait a few seconds, cycle the ignition off and back on and it fired right up. I ended up replacing my ehc with a thunderheart I wired myself and been problem free for almost 2 years now.
     
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  16. Ernie12

    Ernie12 Active Member

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    I dont know anything about motorcycles but if this were happening in a truck or car and you have checked out everything like you have I would check out the crank position sensor. What you are describing is exactly what happens when it goes bad in a car or truck. With regards to it just shutting off and then restarting 5min or so later and then you are on your way.
     
    #16 Ernie12, Oct 17, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2018
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  17. No H2O

    No H2O Active Member
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    is this silver box with a sword going through a heart the thunderheart ehc that you're recommending?
    I don't think my situation's as random as yours since It's always been after a few days of sitting, first ride in the AM, less than 5 miles.
     

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  18. MossBerg590

    MossBerg590 Active Member

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    That looks like your ignition module
     
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  19. No H2O

    No H2O Active Member
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    Anyone know roughly how much parts and labor is to replace the crank position sensor?
     
  20. HMAN

    HMAN Just like to ride
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